PILOT SPIN
Spin Zone => Spin Zone => Topic started by: Mase on January 28, 2017, 07:56:23 PM
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It amazes me that a lot of the same people that applauded Obama's action to return Cubans who escaped back to the gulag are now criticizing Trump for trying to keep jihadis out of the U.S.
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Yep
Here's a novel concept! Follow our laws.
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A federal judge has issued a bar to Trump's executive order:
http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/US_TRUMP?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2017-01-28-23-02-13
It's only limited to those who already had legal visas and green cards it appears. It doesn't make sense to deny entry to those with green cards who've already been vetted.
I'm still waiting for someone to tell me how the executive order is a violation of someone's rights. Cite a federal law or the part of the Constitution where it says we must allow anybody to come into our country at any time.
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David French wrote a great article in the National Review on this topic:
So, what did Trump do? Did he implement his promised Muslim ban? No, far from it. He backed down dramatically from his campaign promises and instead signed an executive order dominated mainly by moderate refugee restrictions and temporary provisions aimed directly at limiting immigration from jihadist conflict zones.
http://www.nationalreview.com/article/444370/donald-trump-refugee-executive-order-no-muslim-ban-separating-fact-hysteria
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Are people actually upset that President Trump didn't bar all muslims from entering the USA?
Is there anyone at all that is upset?
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Are people actually upset that President Trump didn't bar all muslims from entering the USA?
Is there anyone at all that is upset?
No, they're claiming he did ban all Muslims which isn't even close to true.
Now that Trump is using his pen and phone it's somehow not alright anymore.
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https://sethfrantzman.com/2017/01/28/obamas-administration-made-the-muslim-ban-possible-and-the-media-wont-tell-you/
Good article
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But Slick Willie was a democrat. It's OK for a democrat to use that language, but it is racist and bigoted when spoken by a republican.
Hope that clears up any misunderstanding. ::)
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Someone recently posted a humorous meme of GWB asking "Do you miss me yet?"
Each year Obama was in office, the (liberal) answer was "Nope".
But then in 2017, when Trump became President, the answer was "Sweet Jesus, YES".
Exactly the same could be said about Bill Clinton.
When GWB was in office, I didn't miss Bill at all.
But when BHO became President, I would have loved to have Bill back.
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http://www.breitbart.com/video/2017/01/29/kellyanne-conway-inconvenience-to-1-percent-of-travelers-a-small-price-to-pay.
Apparently she is on Fox every Sunday morning. Also, Trump has a weekly address every Friday.
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So Hillary tweets of Trump today, "This is not who we are."
Thread title accurate (even if misspelled). :)
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So Hillary tweets of Trump today, "This is not who we are."
Thread title accurate (even if misspelled). :)
Does anyone really care what that sick tired corrupt criminal has to say?
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Does anyone really care what that sick tired corrupt criminal has to say?
She won the popular vote so she's basically the president. Right?
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She won the popular vote so she's basically the president. Right?
Not according to our constitution, the electoral college and the Congress.
She's a has been who has extinguished her political career. The tired sick corrupt criminal is just trying anything in a feeble attempt to stay relevant.
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Not according to our constitution, the electoral college and the Congress.
She's a has been who has extinguished her political career. The tired sick corrupt criminal is just trying anything in a feeble attempt to stay relevant.
I wasn't being serious.
She can attempt to stay relevant as much as she wants, but she isn't. She lost the election and the only people who are listening to her are the ones who don't understand how the Constitution works.
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So Hillary tweets of Trump today, "This is not who we are."
Thread title accurate (even if misspelled). :)
Fixed tyvm.
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I wasn't being serious.
She can attempt to stay relevant as much as she wants, but she isn't. She lost the election and the only people who are listening to her are the ones who don't understand how the Constitution works.
They know HOW it works. They just don't like it when it applies to them.
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They know HOW it works. They just don't like it when it applies to them.
There are some who know how it works, but many do not. The masses that you see protesting and crying about popular vote totals clearly do not understand how it works. They don't understand that we are not a democracy nor that the Constitution exists and must be adhered to in order to prevent the collapse of our society. I also don't see those who are higher up in the left (DNC members, elected officials, etc.) going out of their way to stop the protestors or provide them with the information.
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I also don't see those who are higher up in the left (DNC members, elected officials, etc.) going out of their way to stop the protestors or provide them with the information.
Misinformation is a useful tool.
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President Trump's order was not unconstitutional or illegal, that is what liberal say whenever they don't like something. But pin then down, what part of the constitution, what law did it interfere with? It is not banning on the basis of national origin, it is banning on the basis of the nations of terrorism. It is not a ban, it is temporary stoppage. Their ability to travel to the US will come back in 3-4 months. If you want to claim that it is, then please explain your lack of outrage over the banning of North Koreans from travel to the US. And why you're not upset over a ban on Cuban cigars.
It is not unconstitutional. There's really nothing else to say about it. It's not a usurpation of Congress's power because Congress made the laws and the president is ordering the agencies on the execution of the law. That current order is review security. While doing so, stop taking in people from countries that produce terrorists. This is actually a much milder version of Obama's DREAM program...note, not The Dream Act, which Congress voted against as a bad idea. But Obama still went ahead and implemented it via executive action. So, if you didn't want president Trump to have to power to do this now, the time to stop it was between 10 days and 2912 days ago. Anytime in that time frame, when your guy was in in office, that was when you has the authority to say that executive actions that countermanded law were a bad thing.
So, here it is...
Executive actions that countermand law are a bad thing. But the bar is already set and nobody is going to listen to me about this.
The real problem I see is that Trump was very clumsy in executing this. It was rushed, so nobody knew who it applied to or what to do about it. Panicked government workers did what panicked government workers do - they applied it to everyone it might apply to and created a media field day for democrats. It's the difference between a president with 8 years of experience doing these things and one with 8 days of experience.
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Interesting to note that the Alt Left MSM is labeling this as a "Muslim Ban", when in fact it is not.
The fake news propagators continue on.
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President Trump's order was not unconstitutional or illegal, that is what liberal say whenever they don't like something. But pin then down, what part of the constitution, what law did it interfere with? It is not banning on the basis of national origin, it is banning on the basis of the nations of terrorism. It is not a ban, it is temporary stoppage. Their ability to travel to the US will come back in 3-4 months. If you want to claim that it is, then please explain your lack of outrage over the banning of North Koreans from travel to the US. And why you're not upset over a ban on Cuban cigars.
It is not unconstitutional. There's really nothing else to say about it. It's not a usurpation of Congress's power because Congress made the laws and the president is ordering the agencies on the execution of the law. That current order is review security. While doing so, stop taking in people from countries that produce terrorists. This is actually a much milder version of Obama's DREAM program...note, not The Dream Act, which Congress voted against as a bad idea. But Obama still went ahead and implemented it via executive action. So, if you didn't want president Trump to have to power to do this now, the time to stop it was between 10 days and 2912 days ago. Anytime in that time frame, when your guy was in in office, that was when you has the authority to say that executive actions that countermanded law were a bad thing.
So, here it is...
Executive actions that countermand law are a bad thing. But the bar is already set and nobody is going to listen to me about this.
The real problem I see is that Trump was very clumsy in executing this. It was rushed, so nobody knew who it applied to or what to do about it. Panicked government workers did what panicked government workers do - they applied it to everyone it might apply to and created a media field day for democrats. It's the difference between a president with 8 years of experience doing these things and one with 8 days of experience.
I don't think it was panicked government workers, I think it was a deliberate misapplication of the EO in order to create standing for a suit - there are likely still thousands if not tens of thousands of left-wing fellow travellers throughout the various organs of FedGov who are each primed for this - like the national park employees who are tweeting their MMGW hysteria after being order not to communicate without prior approval (like almost every private sector business I have ever worked for).
Make no mistake, this remains a battle between the political establishment and the people - and the establishment contains hundreds of thousands of policy wonks, apparatchiks and cogs in the wheel, many of whom do not support this president or his agenda.
'Gimp
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No, I"m not mistaken at that at all. But I have learned a rule to never assume malfeasance where simple stupidity will suffice. I don't think the president's team is experienced enough politically to intentionally screw this up. That would be giving more credit than they are due.
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I don't think it was panicked government workers, I think it was a deliberate misapplication of the EO in order to create standing for a suit - there are likely still thousands if not tens of thousands of left-wing fellow travellers throughout the various organs of FedGov who are each primed for this - like the national park employees who are tweeting their MMGW hysteria after being order not to communicate without prior approval (like almost every private sector business I have ever worked for).
Make no mistake, this remains a battle between the political establishment and the people - and the establishment contains hundreds of thousands of policy wonks, apparatchiks and cogs in the wheel, many of whom do not support this president or his agenda.
'Gimp
Well said.
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'Gimp
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So much disinformation by the lap dog press. We institute a temporary ban for seven of twenty-four Muslim nations and the press goes nuts. It is just unbelievable to me. Interesting side note, my 17 year old grand-daughter unfriended me on FB :)
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So much disinformation by the lap dog press. We institute a temporary ban for seven of twenty-four Muslim nations and the press goes nuts. It is just unbelievable to me. Interesting side note, my 17 year old grand-daughter unfriended me on FB :)
Are you going to unfriend her in your will?
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Are you going to unfriend her in your will?
I have told her in the past to make up her own mind on things. I guess she did and will become a snow flake.
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and, on cue, BHO weighs in on the situation.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4173180/Obama-says-heartened-protests.html
President Barack Obama has weighed in publicly on a political issue for the first time since leaving office – sending out support for demonstrations that have spread across the country in protest of President Donald Trump's immigration order.
'President Obama is heartened by the level of engagement taking place in communities around the country,' according to a statement released by his post-presidential office.
'Citizens exercising their Constitutional right to assemble, organize and have their voices heard by their elected officials is exactly what we expect to see when American values are at stake,' Obama said.
Obama was most likely directly countering a remark made by President Trump: that 'My policy is similar to what President Obama did in 2011 when he banned visas for refugees from Iraq for six months.'
The Washington Post's fact checker rated this a 'facile' claim with three Pinocchios, because the Obama administration didn't halt Iraq admissions. The administration clamped down on Iraqi admissions in 2011 while it ran names against federal databases, after an Iraqi man who had been granted asylum was found to have have constructed roadside bombs in Iraq.
See how the alt left news twist the story? They seem to leave out that the Trump "muslim ban" is actually a temporary halt while the government works to increase vetting, much along the same lines as Obama.
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The Democrat talking points have been used all day by folks on FB. I'm wearing my fingers out responding to the "notice that none fo the countries Trump does business with are on the list" and the "bans all Muslims" one.
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The Democrat talking points have been used all day by folks on FB. I'm wearing my fingers out responding to the "notice that none fo the countries Trump does business with are on the list" and the "bans all Muslims" one.
I know right, like they get two or three memes and then stick to it - I have family members all but calling me a racist POS today, but standing my ground - I figure the masses will tire of the outrage du juor soon but the perpetually offended are off their rocker and will, I predict, escalate their behavior which, I also predict, will only serve to strengthen Trump's resolve and continue to weed out the weak-knee RINO's and unmask the all-in complicit radical alt-left-government-media-complex, all of which need to happen.
My fave so far is people complaining that Trump's EO uses terrible and confusing language, insinuating he wrote it himself and is a moron, when it takes word for word from Obama declarations and lists and EO's, and so on - the man is playing everyone like a freaking Stradivarius - it is quite enjoyable.
Apparently like the race card, even Godwin can in fact be overplayed to the point it loses power, which is a shame in a way, the real Nazi's were terrible people, like George Soros.
'Gimp
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I know right, like they get two or three memes and then stick to it - I have family members all but calling me a racist POS today, but standing my ground - I figure the masses will tire of the outrage du juor soon but the perpetually offended are off their rocker and will, I predict, escalate their behavior which, I also predict, will only serve to strengthen Trump's resolve and continue to weed out the weak-knee RINO's and unmask the all-in complicit radical alt-left-government-media-complex, all of which need to happen.
My fave so far is people complaining that Trump's EO uses terrible and confusing language, insinuating he wrote it himself and is a moron, when it takes word for word from Obama declarations and lists and EO's, and so on - the man is playing everyone like a freaking Stradivarius - it is quite enjoyable.
Apparently like the race card, even Godwin can in fact be overplayed to the point it loses power, which is a shame in a way, the real Nazi's were terrible people, like George Soros.
'Gimp
Trump is a freaking genius.
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You have to really laugh when Trump asked who Chuck Shumer was using as an acting coach. The democrats and the alt left MSM have never had anyone stand up to them and call out their bullshit.
Truly a wonderful thing!
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On a kind of sad note, my 17 year old grand daughter has apparently gone snow flake. She unfriended me on FB.
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On a kind of sad note, my 17 year old grand daughter has apparently gone snow flake. She unfriended me on FB.
This is one reason I do not post politics on FB. No matter what I posted I would lose half my friends, because my friends all all over the political spectrum.
You granddaughter has been propagandized all her life. It isn't her fault.
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On a kind of sad note, my 17 year old grand daughter has apparently gone snow flake. She unfriended me on FB.
Not a grand daughter! Awwwww. :'( My niece claims to be independent, voted third party (probably Stein) but everything she "likes" on FB is of the wacko left. I had to unfollow my brother and sister in law because they both kept spamming hate filled leftist crap but I would never unfriend family. You can unfollow without unfriending. My brother and I came close though, this election cycle. He's a 50 year old "snowflake". Ex Marine.... HOW????? Because he married a liberal Brit I guess. Has to believe like the wife says. At least he's still pro second amendment. That much Marine stayed in him. He and I have agreed to not talk about politics for the sake of family peace. My brother and I cannot communicate through FB. That place is evil. We've gone to texting and occasional phone calls, keeping the subjects entirely "sterile".
I hope your grand daughter comes around.
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Because he married a liberal Brit I guess. Has to believe like the wife says.
How the fuck did the common misconception that men ruled the world ever come about when practically every household is like this; except for a few cases, which are usually prosecuted for spousal abuse.
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How the fuck did the common misconception that men ruled the world ever come about when practically every household is like this; except for a few cases, which are usually prosecuted for spousal abuse.
We all got here together.
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How the fuck did the common misconception that men ruled the world ever come about when practically every household is like this; except for a few cases, which are usually prosecuted for spousal abuse.
maybe in the USA, but I'm not so sure about other places (usually with lots of sand)
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I married a liberal. But thank God she fixed herself. It's amazing what happens when you show people the truth and common sense.
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I married a liberal. But thank God she fixed herself. It's amazing what happens when you show people the truth and common sense.
I suppose it would depend on why the person is a liberal.
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You have to really laugh when Trump asked who Chuck Shumer was using as an acting coach.
Whoever coached Chuck-you Schumer was a piker.
Now this was great acting.
http://madlyodd.com/carol-burnett-show-bloopers/
(http://madlyodd.com/carol-burnett-show-bloopers/)
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If you get them young enough sometimes you can fix them. I'm working on my niece and I suspect I'm the reason she doesn't outright claim to be liberal. I'm not inundating her with right wing stuff, that doesn't work because those sources can be just as shrill and biased. I'm encouraging her to go to ALL sources on both sides and to use her own critical thinking skills to sort out truth from fiction. The facts are there but you have to go beyond getting all your news from the facebook feed and mainstream media.
But it's a job, you have to undo 12 years of public school indoctrination and then 4 years of university brainwashing. But if as in the case of my niece, she has not really been interested in politics at all until now, she's a clean slate other than the rhetoric that's been pounded into her. She has not engaged in a lot of deep rationalization yet.
But when they get old, like my brother, they've spent a lifetime building a strong rationalized structure of thought, all based on false foundations, but now set like concrete. I don't hold out any hope I'd ever be able to change him now, even without the wife.
Just like the false foundation of what you said Little Joe. The falsehood that males are somehow keeping females oppressed in this country. There is no wage discrimination. If there were, all employers would hire only women, because they'd be getting a deal. The payment disparity is because women are less productive and a higher risk to hire, because they still quit when they have babies, or take more time off.
I can't speak to how things were before I was born (mid 50s) but in my lifetime I have experienced exactly zero gender discrimination. I had a great career in a male dominated field (engineering). I've always been able to do anything I want, even in male dominated activities, like fly airplanes and shoot guns. I can also do female dominated things like sewing and baking, without the stigma of being an effeminate fruit. I perceive my world and opportunities to be much greater and more free than men's.
I have been able to work full time when I chose, and then quit and live off my husband when I chose. For the price of what? Having to keep the house reasonably clean for him? Cook a dinner most nights? Women call THAT being oppressed? It's NOTHING compared to what men go through daily to provide for us. And lets talk about men. The most dangerous and boring jobs go to males almost exclusively. Garbage pickup. Construction, soldiering in combat. By the way, why on earth women are screaming "sex discrimination" because they aren't allowed to go into combat is beyond me. Be careful what you wish for bitches. We are going to see the day drafting for combat includes women. Thanks a lot. Yeah I was really jealous of those guys registering for the draft during the Vietnam war. ::)
For me, I'm happy to let the big strong men be warriors for me. Although if you're a diesel dyke and wish to have the exact same job as a man, I feel you should as long as you can pass the same physical strength standards. I don't believe in lowering standards just to let in women. But I also don't believe in discrimination so if you are female and can pass the standards, you should be let in.
But such women are not the ones with whom I have a problem. I have a problem with the precious little whiny clueless spoiled brats who demand that standards be adjusted for them. The young females protesting for "women's rights" in America today have reached a level of narcissistic self absorption I thought possible only in the most warped personality disorder, a level of deep ignorance and lack of insight that is beyond belief. A sense of entitlement far worse than any spoiled princess in any fairy tale.
But back to my point, THIS is an example of a false belief my brother apparently holds as a foundation for his liberalism - believing somehow that in America today females are still oppressed. How much does a person have to twist and warp their brain to believe this? How much must you deliberately shut your eyes to reality in front of you to believe like this? People like this actually believe that because Hillary lost the EC she did so because she's female and we are still oppressing women. Are you kidding me? Hillary reached heights of power and influence of which the great majority of males in this country couldn't even dream.
These snowflakes are crying and whining over poor Hillary having been oppressed by not being elected and what do they feel for the LITERALLY poor male without a job who voted for Trump - absolute contempt. If giving women the vote led to this kind of spoiled rotten confused priorities, we never should have done it.
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This is one reason I do not post politics on FB. No matter what I posted I would lose half my friends, because my friends all all over the political spectrum.
You granddaughter has been propagandized all her life. It isn't her fault.
Her father, my oldest son, is the only conservative in that family. His wife and son are also on the left, although my grand son really doesn't get into this, I think he just picks it up from those around him. The biggest leftist is my youngest son. At this point I think he has swung his wife over and I'm sure his two sons just follow what Dad says since they are young (grade school and middle school). I think the grand daughter got most of it from my youngest son since she adores him. She also plans to go to school overseas. Gonna save the world I think.
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http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2017/jan/30/people-need-to-get-over-the-so-called-muslim-ban/
Look, global elites, nobody said self-governance would be easy. Or pretty. But it is what it is. Get over it.
The full-bore freak-out hysteria over President Trump’s executive order directed at finally getting a grip on who exactly is coming into the United States from the Middle East has been amusing.
But it also reveals something terribly sinister about the wacko protesters, the mainstream media and an alarming number of actual sitting politicians. They really do not believe voters should have a say in how we are governed.
Or, as their hero-God former President Obama once said: Elections matter.
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I wonder how many people have actually read the Executive Order...
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Her father, my oldest son, is the only conservative in that family. His wife and son are also on the left, although my grand son really doesn't get into this, I think he just picks it up from those around him. The biggest leftist is my youngest son. At this point I think he has swung his wife over and I'm sure his two sons just follow what Dad says since they are young (grade school and middle school). I think the grand daughter got most of it from my youngest son since she adores him. She also plans to go to school overseas. Gonna save the world I think.
Have been thinking about your granddaughter. My stepson is constantly showing me (he understands my frustration with The Young) that large groups of The Young are actually supporting Trump. One that comes to mind is Millennials for Trump; I believe they are on Facebook. The March for Life had large numbers of The Young.
I understand that even cogent presentations of the facts don't work when someone won't listen. This does seem to be a time where we can speak, keep our dignity while observing others' lack of it, and let the situation unfold. Obviously, much of what is happening is exposing the left's fear of more exposure of their gross hypocrisy and weird and ineffective governing through the years.
Lots of neat articles online about how to talk to liberal family members. But I know ... silence is sometimes best. Funny how the left waves signs opposing hate and promoting love, while hating their fellow countrymen. I've seen young people evolve from rabidly liberal to conservative, but it takes some years. Often happens when they see the chunk of change the FedGov takes from their first paycheck. Suddenly, how the government is spending money the young person earned becomes more important. Plus, the virtue signalling of being faux compassionate is difficult to maintain because it is so faux. Hence, Democratic losses in government, and even (I read the other day) several states that were dark blue are now turning red.
A counselor once told me, "The organism wants to be healthy." I believe, hope and pray that our country (the part that is not currently rabidly hostile to the other part) is quietly fulfilling that maxim.
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Have been thinking about your granddaughter. My stepson is constantly showing me (he understands my frustration with The Young) that large groups of The Young are actually supporting Trump. One that comes to mind is Millennials for Trump; I believe they are on Facebook. The March for Life had large numbers of The Young.
I understand that even cogent presentations of the facts don't work when someone won't listen. This does seem to be a time where we can speak, keep our dignity while observing others' lack of it, and let the situation unfold. Obviously, much of what is happening is exposing the left's fear of more exposure of their gross hypocrisy and weird and ineffective governing through the years.
Lots of neat articles online about how to talk to liberal family members. But I know ... silence is sometimes best. Funny how the left waves signs opposing hate and promoting love, while hating their fellow countrymen. I've seen young people evolve from rabidly liberal to conservative, but it takes some years. Often happens when they see the chunk of change the FedGov takes from their first paycheck. Suddenly, how the government is spending money the young person earned becomes more important. Plus, the virtue signalling of being faux compassionate is difficult to maintain because it is so faux. Hence, Democratic losses in government, and even (I read the other day) several states that were dark blue are now turning red.
A counselor once told me, "The organism wants to be healthy." I believe, hope and pray that our country (the part that is not currently rabidly hostile to the other part) is quietly fulfilling that maxim.
In general we do not talk politics at family get togethers. At a dinner one time we were discussing something and I told her it was important that she make her own decisions. Apparently she has ;)
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Are people actually upset that President Trump didn't bar all muslims from entering the USA?
Scott Adams would tell you that the left is. You see, if Trump turns out NOT to be Hitler incarnate, then they were very wrong, very publicly. Their ego can't handle that, so they secretly wish for exactly what they claim to fear.
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Scott Adams would tell you that the left is. You see, if Trump turns out NOT to be Hitler incarnate, then they were very wrong, very publicly. Their ego can't handle that, so they secretly wish for exactly what they claim to fear.
Exactly. The left is scared that Trump may actually be a success.
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On a kind of sad note, my 17 year old grand daughter has apparently gone snow flake. She unfriended me on FB.
That kid needs a swift kick in the ass by her parents. I would ring her neck if it were my daughter.