PILOT SPIN
Spin Zone => Spin Zone => Topic started by: Little Joe on September 25, 2016, 05:13:07 AM
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What would be the objection to this idea?
At the polling places, ask potential voters to show a photo id.
If they don't have one, then have them sign a form that swears they are who they say they are. They print and sign their names and they affix their fingerprint. Everybody gets a fingerprint for free when they are born, so there is no discrimination here.
The fingerprints are matched against existing databases. If there is no match, the prints are stored and matched against any future fingerprint searches. Say John Smith is arrested for rape a few years from now. His fingerprints are searched and it turns out he voted as Willly Wonka in 2016. Now, even if he gets off with time served for the rape (since he is a respectable white athlete), he will still serve time for voter fraud.
Yes, it will cost tons more and not be as effective as voter id, but hey, this is the government. What else is new?
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Even better: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Election_ink
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What would be the objection to this idea?
At the polling places, ask potential voters to show a photo id.
If they don't have one, then have them sign a form that swears they are who they say they are. They print and sign their names and they affix their fingerprint. Everybody gets a fingerprint for free when they are born, so there is no discrimination here.
The fingerprints are matched against existing databases. If there is no match, the prints are stored and matched against any future fingerprint searches. Say John Smith is arrested for rape a few years from now. His fingerprints are searched and it turns out he voted as Willly Wonka in 2016. Now, even if he gets off with time served for the rape (since he is a respectable white athlete), he will still serve time for voter fraud.
Yes, it will cost tons more and not be as effective as voter id, but hey, this is the government. What else is new?
How about matching the finger prints against each other and against the criminal database of felons? You can't do it right away, but how quickly can you do it? The ballots are provisional until cleared through the database and in a close race, the results cannot be certified until they are.
I like the idea.
But you're racist for suggesting it. I don't know how, but just wait.
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Nothing like expensive solutions to nonexistent problems.
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Nothing like expensive solutions to nonexistent problems.
You misunderstand. The problem is confidence in the voting system. It is way too easy to commit fraud in this system, virtually impossible to detect it and a very small likelihood of suffering any consequences for doing it.
With as easy it is to do, I cannot comprehend that it is not occurring, nor anyone being able to definitely state that it is not occurring because the only artifact after the fraud is completed is a vote, a ballot which looks exactly like every valid ballot.
Fraud not happening would require a populace with a much higher moral code that they exhibit in every other aspect of life. So every time that someone says "there's no fraud going on", I hear "don't look too close, I don't want you to find it".
I'm not alone in this.
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Nothing like expensive solutions to nonexistent problems.
Have you ever been robbed?
Do you have locks on your doors?
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What would be the objection to this idea?
At the polling places, ask potential voters to show a photo id.
If they don't have one, then have them sign a form that swears they are who they say they are. They print and sign their names and they affix their fingerprint. Everybody gets a fingerprint for free when they are born, so there is no discrimination here.
The fingerprints are matched against existing databases. If there is no match, the prints are stored and matched against any future fingerprint searches. Say John Smith is arrested for rape a few years from now. His fingerprints are searched and it turns out he voted as Willly Wonka in 2016. Now, even if he gets off with time served for the rape (since he is a respectable white athlete), he will still serve time for voter fraud.
Yes, it will cost tons more and not be as effective as voter id, but hey, this is the government. What else is new?
Mandatory fingerprint databases? How about DNA databases?
No thank you. The government already knows too much about me.
My job when I vote is to prove I'm a citizen, and prove I live where I say I live. End of story.
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Have you ever been robbed?
Do you have locks on your doors?
Yes and yes.
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You misunderstand. The problem is confidence in the voting system. It is way too easy to commit fraud in this system, virtually impossible to detect it and a very small likelihood of suffering any consequences for doing it.
First, the gain in voter fraud is minimal (at least for identity fraud, for which these laws are designed) and the penalty huge. It truly is a Federal offense. Second, most of the laws counteracting it have been passed by politically motivated Republicans to suppress Democratic, particularly African American voting. This has been stated publicly and privately by some of the laws promoters. The only reason you're worried about it is you've been made to be worried about it. The Force has a strong effect on the weak-minded.
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First, the gain in voter fraud is minimal
You're making a statement of fact. How do YOU know? I want to believe in the integrity of the voting system, please share your knowledge.
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First, the gain in voter fraud is minimal (at least for identity fraud, for which these laws are designed) and the penalty huge. It truly is a Federal offense. Second, most of the laws counteracting it have been passed by politically motivated Republicans to suppress Democratic, particularly African American voting. This has been stated publicly and privately by some of the laws promoters. The only reason you're worried about it is you've been made to be worried about it. The Force has a strong effect on the weak-minded.
So since the Democratic Party is the birthplace of the KKK and the democrats have done more to suppress the blacks in this country through legislation, why is it the Republicans, who have done more for the rights of blacks historically trying to suppress their vote?
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Mandatory fingerprint databases? How about DNA databases?
No thank you. The government already knows too much about me.
My job when I vote is to prove I'm a citizen, and prove I live where I say I live. End of story.
That's a valid concern.
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You're making a statement of fact. How do YOU know? I want to believe in the integrity of the voting system, please share your knowledge.
Because the gain (1 vote) is offset by HUGE penalties (felony record and incarceration). The only way to really offset and election is conspiracy to commit identity fraud en masse, and criminal conspiracies tend to be undone. GOPers have looked for this sort of voter fraud extensively and never found it. Last I saw were 31 incidents in a billion votes cast.
There are all kinds of election fraud that can indeed change results that have been used extensively in the past and will never be detected by the current crop of laws. Vote buying, coercion, ballot stuffing, and others have been used in the past and are likely in play now. But the laws designed to prevent identity fraud are an expensive fix for a nearly non-existent problem. They're real purpose is to reduce African American Democratic voting. At that they are quite effective, as has been stated by their purveyors and by the judiciary.
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They're real purpose is to reduce African American Democratic voting.
Please explain how that is true?
What percentage of blacks do you think cannot obtain an ID?
What percentage of whites do you think cannot obtain an ID?
If there is any difference, to what do you attribute the difference?
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They're real purpose is to reduce African American Democratic voting. At that they are quite effective, as has been stated by their purveyors and by the judiciary.
Yet another lie being perpetuated through liberal talking points.
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From the Horses mouth:
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Because the gain (1 vote) is offset by HUGE penalties (felony record and incarceration). The only way to really offset and election is conspiracy to commit identity fraud en masse, and criminal conspiracies tend to be undone. GOPers have looked for this sort of voter fraud extensively and never found it. Last I saw were 31 incidents in a billion votes cast.
There are all kinds of election fraud that can indeed change results that have been used extensively in the past and will never be detected by the current crop of laws. Vote buying, coercion, ballot stuffing, and others have been used in the past and are likely in play now. But the laws designed to prevent identity fraud are an expensive fix for a nearly non-existent problem. They're real purpose is to reduce African American Democratic voting. At that they are quite effective, as has been stated by their purveyors and by the judiciary.
Still an unconvincing argument. You're saying that very few people get caught, which is exactly what I'm saying the problem is.
Additionally, the penalties are NOT very severe. In North Carolina, stealing a vote (voting in someone else's name) is a Class I felony (that is eye - H, I, J) . That's one level lower than stealing a bale of pine needles. Stealing a vote carries a 3-4 month sentencing guideline for the first through 3rd offense. The fourth time gets you 5 months. Oh, but the first through third offenses are community service, the 4th gets you a suspended sentence. You have to do it 5 times before you might go to jail.
But how can you prove "stealing a vote" if it was successful? You can't, you can only catch the people who are dumb enough to try to vote twice using the same registration or who try to have two registrations.
BTW, this page (http://www.discoverthenetworks.org/viewSubCategory.asp?id=2214) list many, many more than 31 counts of people being caught at voting illegally. And it's not listing everyone. There are probably at least 15 people in NC who voted early then showed up again to vote in person...let the stupid be punished. But how many voted under different names which is effectively untraceable without ID?