Post by: Anthony on March 18, 2020, 06:32:41 AM
So I guess if people don't resist and allow their personal possessions to be stolen, then it is non violent and nobody gets arrested? Wow, talk about creating a break down in society.
https://dailycaller.com/2020/03/17/philadelphia-police-to-stop-arrests-coronavirus/
Post by: bflynn on March 18, 2020, 06:44:14 AM
Post by: Anthony on March 18, 2020, 07:03:01 AM
Will they be picking up dead bodies from people who break into homes and get shot by the homeowner?
Well many that actually have valuable possessions in Philly are Limousine Liberals (Progressives) who voluntarily remain unarmed, because they are against private, legal gun ownership. They only think the police and military (Government) should have guns. I wonder what they are thinking now?
However, there are still some armed Americans remaining in that Hell Hole, and yes there may be some encounters with looters, car jackers, burglars, etc that will need to be removed posthumously.
Post by: TimRB on March 18, 2020, 08:33:01 AM
They only think the police and military (Government) should have guns. I wonder what they are thinking now?
"I have heard" (apocryphal story, probable bullshit follows) that some people in places like California who are lining up to buy guns (probably their first) for defense from the zombies are finding out to their dismay that they are NOT able to simply waltz into a gun store and walk out with a gun, as they've been told by the gun-grabbers for years. I hope at least some of them will seek out a knowledgeable friend, or even an organized class, to get a little training with their new security tools.
Anyway, I like the idea of more people owning guns who don't think the things are just for hunting. If I hear one more politician say "Hey, I support the Second Amendment--I have a shotgun and shoot ducks..."
Tim
Post by: Anthony on March 18, 2020, 08:37:01 AM
"I have heard" (apocryphal story, probable bullshit follows) that some people in places like California who are lining up to buy guns (probably their first) for defense from the zombies are finding out to their dismay that they are NOT able to simply waltz into a gun store and walk out with a gun, as they've been told by the gun-grabbers for years. I hope at least some of them will seek out a knowledgeable friend, or even an organized class, to get a little training with their new security tools.
Anyway, I like the idea of more people owning guns who don't think the things are just for hunting. If I hear one more politician say "Hey, I support the Second Amendment--I have a shotgun and shoot ducks..."
Tim
We have two anti (legal) gun groups against us. Those that think no private citizens should legally own guns and the FUDDS who think that guns are just for hunting. Neither are at all what the Second Amendment is all about.
Post by: Anthony on March 19, 2020, 08:55:07 AM
Yeah, right. You received such an uproar from people you decided not to do it yet, or do it so publicly. Meanwhile my Colt M4 Carbine comes out as primary HD gun, and the old WWII M1 Carbine goes back in the safe.
Post by: Rush on March 19, 2020, 10:18:34 AM
Post by: President-Elect Bob Noel on March 19, 2020, 10:23:20 AM
The narcotics and prostitution I have no problem with. I don’t care if you want to die in a gutter with a needle in your arm or pay a consenting adult for sex. ...
wrt narcotics... ok, I suppose, if the person doesn't burden our medical resources.
How much prostitution is really consensual? How many young girls and boys are coerced at best, enslaved at worst?
Post by: Lucifer on March 19, 2020, 10:26:25 AM
Right now the US economic system is in duress. The leftist are cheering. If they can push it to collapse (Cloward and Piven) then they can bring in their replacement.
This is why you are seeing the demands to open prisons, open the borders and start paying everyone, including illegals. Also the cries for single payer are rising.
Post by: Mr Pou on March 19, 2020, 10:27:34 AM
Post by: Lucifer on March 19, 2020, 10:33:54 AM
My brother is of the opinion that the Dems paid the Chinese to let this loose...
The dims (leftist socialist) and the Chinese have a common goal. They both want the west to collapse, and they both want to see Trump gone.
The Chinese desperately want another Obama in office that will roll over to them. They want politicians that will funnel more money to them and drive more industry to their country. The leftist socialist want the same thing.
Post by: Anthony on March 19, 2020, 10:47:15 AM
My brother is of the opinion that the Dems paid the Chinese to let this loose...
I think the Chinese are sick of Trump and him pushing back on Trade to attempt to level the playing field. They are a very dishonest, vindictive regime. They want to STEAL and make it look like business and commerce. Wars are fought over this shit.
The Democrats, including the Clintons, Obamas, Bidens, etc are bought and paid for by the Chinese.
Post by: Rush on March 19, 2020, 11:04:21 AM
wrt narcotics... ok, I suppose, if the person doesn't burden our medical resources.
How much prostitution is really consensual? How many young girls and boys are coerced at best, enslaved at worst?
That’s why I said consenting adults.
Post by: nddons on March 19, 2020, 11:28:33 AM
The narcotics and prostitution I have no problem with. I don’t care if you want to die in a gutter with a needle in your arm or pay a consenting adult for sex. But personal theft, burglary, and auto theft? That’s giving the green light to committing crimes against innocent people during a crisis. Unforgivable!I don’t think the citizens of San Francisco or those neighboring Skid Row in LA benefit from open narcotic use and needles strewn all over.
Post by: Rush on March 19, 2020, 11:32:52 AM
I don’t think the citizens of San Francisco or those neighboring Skid Row in LA benefit from open narcotic use and needles strewn all over.
And drugs being illegal is preventing those problems.
Post by: President-Elect Bob Noel on March 19, 2020, 11:36:22 AM
That’s why I said consenting adults.
The challenge has always been to determine if they are really consenting.
Post by: Anthony on March 19, 2020, 11:42:31 AM
And drugs being illegal is preventing those problems.
I'm no drug expert, nor crime expert, fortunately, but I've read arguments where legalizing drugs would reduce the crime surrounding its trade.
Look what happened during Prohibition. Legal bars and restaurants couldn't serve it, nor could liquor stores sell it so it went underground. A huge illegal, black market emerged with rival gangs fighting over turf, and violence often spilled out into the street. People still bought liquor illegally, went to speak easies, and made their own liquor. ALL ILLEGALLY.
When Prohibition was repealed the Gangs had to find other illegal substances and sources of revenue. Narcotics, gambling, prostitution, extortion, etc. Yes, I used to watch "The Untouchables". :)
Post by: Rush on March 19, 2020, 11:49:52 AM
The challenge has always been to determine if they are really consenting.
When it’s an adult, at a certain point you have to let people be responsible for themselves.
Like Anthony just said about drugs, maybe it’s the fact that prostitution is illegal that leads to the ugly stuff, like having Mafioso pimps.
Post by: nddons on March 19, 2020, 11:53:07 AM
And drugs being illegal is preventing those problems.Those areas I mentioned are where heroin and other narcotic usage is permitted and not prosecuted, even if illegal. It’s not working well.
Post by: Anthony on March 19, 2020, 11:56:39 AM
When it’s an adult, at a certain point you have to let people be responsible for themselves.
Like Anthony just said about drugs, maybe it’s the fact that prostitution is illegal that leads to the ugly stuff, like having Mafioso pimps.
Then there are the UNIONS. Ugh. >:(
Post by: Rush on March 19, 2020, 12:05:31 PM
Those areas I mentioned are where heroin and other narcotic usage is permitted and not prosecuted, even if illegal. It’s not working well.
You might have a point, but drug problems are closely tied to other societal problems. Is it that they aren’t prosecuted there? Or is it that there are no jobs there or other issues due to policies of the powers that be in that location? It would be interesting to do an unbiased study.
Post by: Old Crow on March 19, 2020, 06:14:58 PM
Post by: Rush on March 19, 2020, 10:38:13 PM
https://www.newsbreak.com/news/0OUIAUeh/jails-across-california-country-release-inmates-because-of-coronavirus?s=oldSite&ss=i3
I agree with that. Jail is a horrible place to be sick. The medical care is atrocious and this:
Crowley said hygiene products are free and readily available to incarcerated people and staff.
Is not true in many cases. They limit toilet paper because inmates use it for nefarious purposes like clogging toilets or making wicks to light and women do not get sufficient feminine hygiene products.
Post by: President-Elect Bob Noel on March 20, 2020, 04:50:03 AM
Conditions in jail aren't a paradise? Too bad, so sad
Post by: Little Joe on March 20, 2020, 04:51:07 AM
and women do not get sufficient feminine hygiene products.I don't consider that nefarious.
Post by: President-Elect Bob Noel on March 20, 2020, 04:59:16 AM
But they are releasing inmates.
Does anyone see the conflict between those two "initiatives"?
Post by: Little Joe on March 20, 2020, 05:04:20 AM
I see that California is ordering the 40 million residents to stay home.It sounds like something you would read on the Onion! Or perhaps on April 1.
But they are releasing inmates.
Does anyone see the conflict between those two "initiatives"?
Post by: Old Crow on March 20, 2020, 05:11:38 AM
Post by: Rush on March 20, 2020, 05:15:39 AM
I don't consider that nefarious.
Not the feminine stuff. The toilet paper. They limit the toilet paper because some prisoners do stuff with it other than use it for its intended purpose. Come to think of it, the feminine products are used to smuggle in drugs and to hide drugs. Still, it’s cruel to deprive people of these basic necessities.
Post by: Anthony on March 20, 2020, 05:45:28 AM
I see that California is ordering the 40 million residents to stay home.
But they are releasing inmates.
Does anyone see the conflict between those two "initiatives"?
So police are being told to stand down for certain crimes, and they are releasing inmates from jail. So, overall a GROWING criminal population in a time when we are put off balance. At least people are home to defend their possessions. However, guns shops have been ordered to close. If you don't have a gun, and/or ammunition, you won't be able to get them now.
Post by: Little Joe on March 20, 2020, 05:54:25 AM
Not the feminine stuff. The toilet paper. They limit the toilet paper because some prisoners do stuff with it other than use it for its intended purpose. Come to think of it, the feminine products are used to smuggle in drugs and to hide drugs. Still, it’s cruel to deprive people of these basic necessities.I thought you were saying women were using TP in place of insufficient feminine products.
Post by: Rush on March 20, 2020, 06:34:13 AM
I thought you were saying women were using TP in place of insufficient feminine products.
Ah I see. No, TP doesn’t work for that purpose. It disintegrates too fast, although in an emergency situation with no other option it’s better than nothing for a very short amount of time.
Post by: Username on March 20, 2020, 06:46:55 AM
Post by: President-Elect Bob Noel on March 20, 2020, 07:27:17 AM
...However, guns shops have been ordered to close. If you don't have a gun, and/or ammunition, you won't be able to get them now.
If you don't have a self-defense gun by now, what have you been waiting for?
Post by: Rush on March 20, 2020, 07:41:19 AM
Back when I thought all prisoners were scum and deserved to suffer I wouldn’t have given two shits about all that, but now, the criminal justice system has become a career building and profit making machine for prosecutors and contractors respectively, and there is now too much incentive to funnel as many people as possible into the system. Too many inmates today don’t deserve to be there, and even if they do, it is clear that prison doesn’t reform, it only makes them worse criminals. Only dangerous, violent people should be in prison and these releases aren’t applying to that category.
Post by: Anthony on March 20, 2020, 07:45:13 AM
If you don't have a self-defense gun by now, what have you been waiting for?
Agreed, but there are people that didn't believe they would ever be necessary, or just don't like guns that all of a sudden want one due to reality of things. Then there are those that just don't think to prepare.
Post by: President-Elect Bob Noel on March 20, 2020, 08:46:43 AM
... Then there are those that just don't think to prepare.
Like the geniuses who need to buy snow shovels right before one of weekly/monthly snowstorms in the north.
Post by: nddons on March 20, 2020, 09:24:32 AM
I see that California is ordering the 40 million residents to stay home.This virus is like a fucking wet dream to these social justice warriors who are using it to fulfill their pathetic demand to change society into their socialist image.
But they are releasing inmates.
Does anyone see the conflict between those two "initiatives"?
Post by: nddons on March 20, 2020, 09:32:47 AM
First, I think that the states in their zeal to open the prison doors will NOT be making determinations of who is violent, who is not, who “shouldn’t” be there, etc. bad people WILL be let go. I have no faith in the judicial system.
I’d appreciate Josh’s perspective as he’s dealt with more “bad guys” than all of us combined.
Second, to say that there are people in prison who shouldn’t be there is ridiculous. With federal and state mandates to ease prison populations, prosecutors and judges give bad guys 3, 4, 10, 20 “second chances” before people get to jail. The belief that there are people in prison for smoking a joint (not saying you’re saying this, but others are) is a lie. It does not happen.
With such liberal sentencing and parole requirements, I firmly believe that the people in prison deserve to be there.
Post by: Lucifer on March 20, 2020, 09:33:12 AM
This virus is like a fucking wet dream to these social justice warriors who are using it to fulfill their pathetic demand to change society into their socialist image.
Stan, this is being manipulated to it's max potential. "Never let a crisis go to waste"-Rham Emmanuel.
We are now fucked as a country. The leftist extremist have now added a new chapter to the playbook, and it works. So from now on, when they want something bad enough, they have all of the tools in place to shut down the country and trash the economy.
What happens this fall when flu season starts? Declare a pandemic and incite fear? Remember, influenza is deadlier than this corona virus by far.
Mark my word, this is not the country we grew up in any longer. And we did it to ourselves. The founding fathers were right.
Post by: Anthony on March 20, 2020, 09:42:57 AM
Stan, this is being manipulated to it's max potential. "Never let a crisis go to waste"-Rham Emmanuel.
We are now fucked as a country. The leftist extremist have now added a new chapter to the playbook, and it works. So from now on, when they want something bad enough, they have all of the tools in place to shut down the country and trash the economy.
What happens this fall when flu season starts? Declare a pandemic and incite fear? Remember, influenza is deadlier than this corona virus by far.
Mark my word, this is not the country we grew up in any longer. And we did it to ourselves. The founding fathers were right.
Drastic times require drastic measures. If this is successful in unseating Trump, the Left will even be more emboldened.
Post by: Lucifer on March 20, 2020, 09:51:42 AM
Drastic times require drastic measures. If this is successful in unseating Trump, the Left will even be more emboldened.
I don't believe it will be the ticket to unseat Trump. If anything, I feel more people after this will see the leftist socialist for what they are, thus making them even more desperate.
But I am alarmed that they have been this successful in crashing the economy. Had the media (the leftist socialist media arm) been responsible this event wouldn't have been so out of control. Right now the MSM is spewing fake news at breakneck speed.
Post by: Rush on March 20, 2020, 01:11:40 PM
Boy I really disagree with you here Rush.
First, I think that the states in their zeal to open the prison doors will NOT be making determinations of who is violent, who is not, who “shouldn’t” be there, etc. bad people WILL be let go. I have no faith in the judicial system.
I’d appreciate Josh’s perspective as he’s dealt with more “bad guys” than all of us combined.
Second, to say that there are people in prison who shouldn’t be there is ridiculous. With federal and state mandates to ease prison populations, prosecutors and judges give bad guys 3, 4, 10, 20 “second chances” before people get to jail. The belief that there are people in prison for smoking a joint (not saying you’re saying this, but others are) is a lie. It does not happen.
With such liberal sentencing and parole requirements, I firmly believe that the people in prison deserve to be there.
The bold part I do agree with, possibly we can't trust them to do what they're saying they're going to do.
But I cannot square that all the people in prison deserve to be there with the U.S. having the highest incarceration rate in the world. And I can't square you saying you have no faith in the judicial system to release only non-violent offenders, yet you apparently do have faith that the system put them all there justly in the first place?
Post by: President-Elect Bob Noel on March 20, 2020, 01:15:47 PM
But I cannot square that all the people in prison deserve to be there with the U.S. having the highest incarceration rate in the world.
What is the inconsistency with that?
Have you taken into consideration the number of convictions for crimes vs the number of reported crimes?
How many murders are there? how many people have been convicted of murder?
How many times have people been mugged? how many people have been convicted of mugging?
How many rapes? how many people have been convicted of rape?
etc
etc
etc
otoh - yes, I know that people have been falsely accused and falsely convicted
Post by: Little Joe on March 20, 2020, 01:55:40 PM
Like the geniuses who need to buy snow shovels right before one of weekly/monthly snowstorms in the north.Or like people that go shopping for home security systems after their home is burglarized.
Post by: Anthony on March 20, 2020, 02:04:29 PM
Or like people that go shopping for home security systems after their home is burglarized.
And they only keep out the non-professional burglars, but that's a start.
Post by: TimRB on March 22, 2020, 10:26:34 AM
And they only keep out the non-professional burglars, but that's a start.
Years ago our house was broken into. At the time I had several guns stored in various closets and drawers, but for some reason the burglars didn't take a single one--big wakeup call. The very next day we piled into the pickup with the mandate "We are not returning home without a gun safe." And we didn't.
I always wondered why they didn't steal any of the guns. I know the cops around here don't put the least effort into finding and apprehending garden-variety burglars, but maybe they will put some effort into catching someone who has stolen guns. So maybe the burglars wanted to keep a low profile.
We much later found out who the burglar was--a neighbor who had long since moved away, but evidently stayed in the area. He was a genuine lowlife who then, and probably still, was in prison for (wait for it) murder committed during a drug deal gone bad.
Tim
Post by: lowtimer on March 22, 2020, 10:54:03 AM
Post by: Rush on March 22, 2020, 11:11:53 AM
Years ago our house was broken into. At the time I had several guns stored in various closets and drawers, but for some reason the burglars didn't take a single one--big wakeup call. The very next day we piled into the pickup with the mandate "We are not returning home without a gun safe." And we didn't.
I always wondered why they didn't steal any of the guns. I know the cops around here don't put the least effort into finding and apprehending garden-variety burglars, but maybe they will put some effort into catching someone who has stolen guns. So maybe the burglars wanted to keep a low profile.
We much later found out who the burglar was--a neighbor who had long since moved away, but evidently stayed in the area. He was a genuine lowlife who then, and probably still, was in prison for (wait for it) murder committed during a drug deal gone bad.
Tim
We bought our first generator AFTER going a week with no power from Hurricane Fran in 1996. Nothing like experience to teach you. We now have a whole house generator. And I’ve been stocking emergency supplies ever since.
Post by: TimRB on March 22, 2020, 11:31:00 AM
We bought our first generator AFTER going a week with no power from Hurricane Fran in 1996.
Generators? Don't get me started--we collect the things. One I inherited, three we bought for our small business, and one I bought to supply 220V to run our pump during power outages.
Tim
Post by: Anthony on March 22, 2020, 02:28:18 PM
Years ago our house was broken into. At the time I had several guns stored in various closets and drawers, but for some reason the burglars didn't take a single one--big wakeup call. The very next day we piled into the pickup with the mandate "We are not returning home without a gun safe." And we didn't.
I always wondered why they didn't steal any of the guns. I know the cops around here don't put the least effort into finding and apprehending garden-variety burglars, but maybe they will put some effort into catching someone who has stolen guns. So maybe the burglars wanted to keep a low profile.
We much later found out who the burglar was--a neighbor who had long since moved away, but evidently stayed in the area. He was a genuine lowlife who then, and probably still, was in prison for (wait for it) murder committed during a drug deal gone bad.
Tim
Gun safes are easily defeated by a Sawsall. It tells the criminals where the guns are LOCATED. One convenient place. That being said, I have one, just so if I do have any stolen, I can say they were in a safe. It doesn't make me feel they are any more secure except from the casual burglar.
Yep, many burglaries are people you know or maybe once removed. I don't trust workers in my home either. They can do a nice recon job on your place, and get an idea of what you have and how secure your home is as well.
Post by: Rush on March 22, 2020, 02:36:46 PM
Gun safes are easily defeated by a Sawsall. It tells the criminals where the guns are LOCATED. One convenient place. That being said, I have one, just so if I do have any stolen, I can say they were in a safe. It doesn't make me feel they are any more secure except from the casual burglar.
Yep, many burglaries are people you know or maybe once removed. I don't trust workers in my home either. They can do a nice recon job on your place, and get an idea of what you have and how secure your home is as well.
Our insurance company wants to know if we have a gun safe, so yes, it helps to get reimbursed if they do get stolen. You did your best to prevent it.
Post by: Anthony on March 22, 2020, 02:54:09 PM
Our insurance company wants to know if we have a gun safe, so yes, it helps to get reimbursed if they do get stolen. You did your best to prevent it.
Yep. They also wanted to know what kind of dog I had. I got GER out and they said they wouldn't insure me because I had a German Shepherd. Ahh, let me finish madam. That's German Shorthaired Pointer. ::)
Post by: jb1842 on March 22, 2020, 03:16:18 PM
Post by: TimRB on March 22, 2020, 03:29:56 PM
I went to order a gun safe yesterday, but the gun store closed for the coronavirus that day for 2 weeks.
There is a lot of variation in gun safe quality from manufacturer to manufacturer. Be sure to do your research before buying. Our first safe is a very good one, but when I went to buy another I was taken in (sight unseen) by a sale on Stack-On "safes". The price was right and shipping was free, so why not? When it arrived I was, to say the least, disappointed, but I kept it because shipping it back would have been a headache and I also intended to put only inexpensive milsurp rifles in it anyway.
Tim
Post by: jb1842 on March 22, 2020, 04:17:28 PM
There is a lot of variation in gun safe quality from manufacturer to manufacturer. Be sure to do your research before buying. Our first safe is a very good one, but when I went to buy another I was taken in (sight unseen) by a sale on Stack-On "safes". The price was right and shipping was free, so why not? When it arrived I was, to say the least, disappointed, but I kept it because shipping it back would have been a headache and I also intended to put only inexpensive milsurp rifles in it anyway.
Tim
I've been looking for a few months now. The big thing for me was to make sure the fire rating was at least an hour and room to put our smaller fire safe boxes with passports, important papers in. And the local gun store will deliver it and bring it into the house for $150.
Post by: TimRB on March 22, 2020, 04:48:53 PM
And the local gun store will deliver it and bring it into the house for $150.
Now there's a bargain! When we brought our safe home I enlisted three of my neighbors, none of us small, to help unload. Just getting the thing inside was a serious grunt-and-groaner--taking it upstairs, as I had originally planned, was absolutely out of the question.
Tim
Post by: Anthony on March 22, 2020, 04:49:49 PM
I kept it because shipping it back would have been a headache and I also intended to put only inexpensive milsurp rifles in it anyway.
Tim
Check the prices of some of those "inexpensive" milsurps today. Those I bought back in the 90's like the Russian SKS's, MAS 49/56, FN 49, Makarovs, Polish Tantals, even Moisins are getting some big bucks.
Post by: President-Elect Bob Noel on March 22, 2020, 04:59:00 PM
Now there's a bargain! When we brought our safe home I enlisted three of my neighbors, none of us small, to help unload. Just getting the thing inside was a serious grunt-and-groaner--taking it upstairs, as I had originally planned, was absolutely out of the question.
Tim
The SnapSafe isn't cheap. But since it comes in pieces (some assembly required), it is really simple to move the parts into place. The heaviest part is the door (about 90lbs, iirc). (just looked at the current prices, wow, the cost has gone up a lot).
Post by: TimRB on March 22, 2020, 05:16:28 PM
Check the prices of some of those "inexpensive" milsurps today.
Good point. I had a C&R license back at the very tail end of the surplus era. For no particular reason bought a mint Mosin Nagant 91/30 for 60 bucks, including all the accessories. 1000 rounds of ammo for another 60. Now the things are going for 300 dollars or more. Go figure.
Tim
Post by: nddons on March 23, 2020, 11:46:42 AM
Yep. They also wanted to know what kind of dog I had. I got GER out and they said they wouldn't insure me because I had a German Shepherd. Ahh, let me finish madam. That's German Shorthaired Pointer. ::)Ah yes, you can tell by the pointy ears, and how they only respond to commands in German.
Post by: Anthony on March 24, 2020, 04:46:44 AM
Ah yes, you can tell by the pointy ears, and how they only respond to commands in German.
My German Shorthair was a sweety, and a great hunting dog. He was friendly to everyone. Although, I'd swear he'd be just as happy going for a walk or hunt with Hitler as he would me. or for that matter Jeffrey Dahmer, Stalin, Mao, the guy in the Silence of the Lambs, Obama, Hillary, Schumer, Pelosi, Oprah.......... He just loved everyone.