PILOT SPIN
Spin Zone => Spin Zone => Topic started by: Jaybird180 on January 20, 2016, 03:37:37 PM
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Article in today's Washington Post
Tamir Rice (https://www.washingtonpost.com/posteverything/wp/2015/12/29/in-tamir-rices-case-the-grand-jury-process-was-turned-upside-down/). Sandra Bland (https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2015/07/21/much-too-early-to-call-jail-cell-hanging-death-of-sandra-bland-suicide-da-says/). Laquan McDonald (https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/chicagos-rotten-system/2015/11/25/500dcaa6-93b1-11e5-a2d6-f57908580b1f_story.html). Freddie Gray (https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/local/baltimore-riots-recap/). These young black Americans, and many other men and women whose names never made national headlines, were recent victims of state violence. But they were also victims of deeper structural racial sins that go back to the founding of our country...
https://www.washingtonpost.com/posteverything/wp/2016/01/15/white-christians-need-to-act-more-christian-than-white/ (https://www.washingtonpost.com/posteverything/wp/2016/01/15/white-christians-need-to-act-more-christian-than-white/)
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What a colossal load of horse dung. More white guilt that has absolutely no place in our society.
"Which stands in sharp contrast to the 82 percent of black Protestants and 80 percent of black Americans, generally, who believe these incidents are “part of a broader pattern of how police treat minorities.”"
That nonsense is perpetrated by a leadership within the black segment of our society who loose any stature or power if the black population simply integrates into our society like very other subgroup of our culture has done for hundreds of years.
Black Lives Matter is based on lies and just like every other attempt to make black members of our society victims. When blacks stop seeing themselves as a group of oppressed victims, and start recognizing they are individuals who are personally responsible for their own destiny, this shameful aspect of our society will be behind us once and for all.
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Hey Jaybird? Where've you been? I missed you.
I disagree with you most of the time, but I still missed your contributions and your food for thought.
Article in today's Washington Post
Tamir Rice (https://www.washingtonpost.com/posteverything/wp/2015/12/29/in-tamir-rices-case-the-grand-jury-process-was-turned-upside-down/). Sandra Bland (https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2015/07/21/much-too-early-to-call-jail-cell-hanging-death-of-sandra-bland-suicide-da-says/). Laquan McDonald (https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/chicagos-rotten-system/2015/11/25/500dcaa6-93b1-11e5-a2d6-f57908580b1f_story.html). Freddie Gray (https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/local/baltimore-riots-recap/). These young black Americans, and many other men and women whose names never made national headlines, were recent victims of state violence. But they were also victims of deeper structural racial sins that go back to the founding of our country...
https://www.washingtonpost.com/posteverything/wp/2016/01/15/white-christians-need-to-act-more-christian-than-white/ (https://www.washingtonpost.com/posteverything/wp/2016/01/15/white-christians-need-to-act-more-christian-than-white/)
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So the 13% of the population is pissed that the 75% of the population isn't self-fladulating, self-hating, self-imolating and not buying into the victim mentality, while blaming it on Christianity.
I see Jaybird is back.
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Hey Jaybird? Where've you been? I missed you.
I disagree with you most of the time, but I still missed your contributions and your food for thought.
Article in today's Washington Post
Tamir Rice (https://www.washingtonpost.com/posteverything/wp/2015/12/29/in-tamir-rices-case-the-grand-jury-process-was-turned-upside-down/). Sandra Bland (https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2015/07/21/much-too-early-to-call-jail-cell-hanging-death-of-sandra-bland-suicide-da-says/). Laquan McDonald (https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/chicagos-rotten-system/2015/11/25/500dcaa6-93b1-11e5-a2d6-f57908580b1f_story.html). Freddie Gray (https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/local/baltimore-riots-recap/). These young black Americans, and many other men and women whose names never made national headlines, were recent victims of state violence. But they were also victims of deeper structural racial sins that go back to the founding of our country...
https://www.washingtonpost.com/posteverything/wp/2016/01/15/white-christians-need-to-act-more-christian-than-white/ (https://www.washingtonpost.com/posteverything/wp/2016/01/15/white-christians-need-to-act-more-christian-than-white/)
Thanks. I haven't been here much and trying to settle back into things at PoA, really miss the discussions we had. It's not often I get to have the same discussions with people that can do more than nod and agree with everything.
Joe- I will have to get back with you later but suffice to say that you might be the demographic that the article suggests you are, which explains your vehemence.
I'm a little tired. Just slogged through 3+hrs of gethomeitis and several threats of wrecking my automobile. <1" snow and 26dF and people lose their minds.
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Honestly, I was going to post a whole big long rant that would go down the page with all kinds of foul words. I went away and came back and I'm better now.
It's not about black and white. The sooner we get past that garbage the better. It's all about culture. It has been for ages now.
Anybody ever notice how when a person with dark brown skin, dark brown eyes and curly dark black hair comes from a place like Kenya, or England, or Australia and doesn't look like they just got out of prison and speaks proper english, even if broken and with a thick accent, they are immediately accepted.
Anybody ever notice how when a person with dark brown skin, dark brown eyes and curly dark black hair goes to university, gets a degree and takes on a profession that they are immediately accepted.
Anybody ever notice how when a person with dark brown skin, dark brown eyes and curly dark black hair takes the office of City Council, mayor, assembly person, representative, senator, attorney general, district attorney, police chief, sheriff, CEO, engineer, doctor, scientist, astronomer, astronaut, fighter pilot, US military General, or President of the fucking US of A that they are immediately accepted?
This is what we have a problem with -
(https://deepresource.files.wordpress.com/2015/12/two-gangsta.jpg)
Trash culture that breeds more and more misery, ignorance, death and incarceration. Stupid makes more stupid over and over again.
This is what we (Americans in general) want-
(http://m3.miiduu.com/store3/90386/image/cache/data/201403/suit_2x-827x1024.jpg)
Now, obviously we don't need to see folks wearing a suit all the time, what everybody wants that loves America, other than just their sorry selves is- assimilation. Do as the dominant culture does. Educate your kids. Inspire them to do better than you do. Want them to learn and not just shut their mouth when they ask questions. Engage with your children and their future. Have them be just like the smart kids in school no matter what they color are.
Millions of people with dark brown skin, dark brown eyes and curly dark black hair, have done exactly this and it has turned out incredibly well for them!!! Learn from them instead of choosing to reject them and cling to an identity that is broken and a proven failure. Don't give in to the "poor us, we have been wronged, now you owe us" culture. Step above that shit.
"Black lives matters" is a crappy joke. All lives matter. It's backward trash culture that doesn't matter and it needs to fade away. Anybody with dark brown skin, dark brown eyes and curly dark black hair needs to work towards this end rather than defend this failed culture. At this point, it makes no matter how we got here, it just matters how we move ahead.
Skin color doesn't matter. Character does. The people and "victims" that the OP posted about, were of poor character and clung to the old culture. They ultimately fell victim to it. Crooked, murderous white cops is part of that culture. Those cops need to be punished if they are truly guilty, but the defenders of the victims have to ask themselves, how did these people get there and what could they have done to never encounter that misery?
Having said this, there obviously are hold outs to the old fucked up white culture white people have had in the past. There are those that want to cling to ideas of "racial supremacy". It will take time to completely cleanse society of this rubbish and we are working on it. It's pretty obvious is if you really look around and not just at the sensational headlines that this is so.
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Well said. Best analysis I've seen.
Stop being a victim and take advantage of the opportunities available.
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How can we get this message VIRAL? Excellent and spot on.
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Honestly, I was going to post a whole big long rant that would go down the page with all kinds of foul words. I went away and came back and I'm better now.
It's not about black and white. The sooner we get past that garbage the better. It's all about culture. It has been for ages now.
Anybody ever notice how when a person with dark brown skin, dark brown eyes and curly dark black hair comes from a place like Kenya, or England, or Australia and doesn't look like they just got out of prison and speaks proper english, even if broken and with a thick accent, they are immediately accepted.
Anybody ever notice how when a person with dark brown skin, dark brown eyes and curly dark black hair goes to university, gets a degree and takes on a profession that they are immediately accepted.
Anybody ever notice how when a person with dark brown skin, dark brown eyes and curly dark black hair takes the office of City Council, mayor, assembly person, representative, senator, attorney general, district attorney, police chief, sheriff, CEO, engineer, doctor, scientist, astronomer, astronaut, fighter pilot, US military General, or President of the fucking US of A that they are immediately accepted?
This is what we have a problem with -
(https://deepresource.files.wordpress.com/2015/12/two-gangsta.jpg)
Trash culture that breeds more and more misery, ignorance, death and incarceration. Stupid makes more stupid over and over again.
This is what we (Americans in general) want-
(http://m3.miiduu.com/store3/90386/image/cache/data/201403/suit_2x-827x1024.jpg)
Now, obviously we don't need to see folks wearing a suit all the time, what everybody wants that loves America, other than just their sorry selves is- assimilation. Do as the dominant culture does. Educate your kids. Inspire them to do better than you do. Want them to learn and not just shut their mouth when they ask questions. Engage with your children and their future. Have them be just like the smart kids in school no matter what they color are.
Millions of people with dark brown skin, dark brown eyes and curly dark black hair, have done exactly this and it has turned out incredibly well for them!!! Learn from them instead of choosing to reject them and cling to an identity that is broken and a proven failure. Don't give in to the "poor us, we have been wronged, now you owe us" culture. Step above that shit.
"Black lives matters" is a crappy joke. All lives matter. It's backward trash culture that doesn't matter and it needs to fade away. Anybody with dark brown skin, dark brown eyes and curly dark black hair needs to work towards this end rather than defend this failed culture. At this point, it makes no matter how we got here, it just matters how we move ahead.
Skin color doesn't matter. Character does. The people and "victims" that the OP posted about, were of poor character and clung to the old culture. They ultimately fell victim to it. Crooked, murderous white cops is part of that culture. Those cops need to be punished if they are truly guilty, but the defenders of the victims have to ask themselves, how did these people get there and what could they have done to never encounter that misery?
Having said this, there obviously are hold outs to the old fucked up white culture white people have had in the past. There are those that want to cling to ideas of "racial supremacy". It will take time to completely cleanse society of this rubbish and we are working on it. It's pretty obvious is if you really look around and not just at the sensational headlines that this is so.
It's only January, but I think this qualifies for post of the year.
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It's only January, but I think this qualifies for post of the year.
+1.
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It's only January, but I think this qualifies for post of the year.
+1.
X2. Dave nailed it.
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(http://www.blacklegalissues.com/img_upld_400/hanging.jpg)
He's wearing a suit too.
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(http://www.blacklegalissues.com/img_upld_400/hanging.jpg)
He's wearing a suit too.
Ouch. That's horrible. Do you have a link for that? I didn't see it in any of the news services, and I peruse them pretty thoroughly. The people that did that need to die too.
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It's only January, but I think this qualifies for post of the year.
I too agree that was a great response.
The only change I would suggest is that the pictured labeled "What we (Americans in general) want" could be changed to show a layman in work clothes just as well. I even think a picture of Jaybird in his daily attire would be great. We just don't want hoods, thugs and trash being pushed in our face and be told it is our fault if we think of them as hoods, thugs and trash.
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He's wearing a suit too.
I always thought you were better than this, but you just sank to a whole new level stupidity that deserves the distain of all rational thinking people.
What a sad worldview, and how sad it is that you and those like you are committed to keep black america on your plantation of stupidity for generations to come. Too bad a segment of our society is being influence by "leaders" espousing these relics of the past.
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The last paragraph of Dave's post:
"Having said this, there obviously are hold outs to the old fucked up white culture white people have had in the past. There are those that want to cling to ideas of "racial supremacy". It will take time to completely cleanse society of this rubbish and we are working on it. It's pretty obvious is if you really look around and not just at the sensational headlines that this is so."
At Dachau there is a haunting, skeletal sculpture with the words in several languages below it: Never Again. No one is saying we should ignore our history; it's history from which we learn.
It's painfully clear that even in the pre-internet age, it was perfectly possible, though even more so now, to find information that supports one's desire to continue to feel oppressed, or to justify one's desire to oppress. It's also possible to move past that and actively work to a better future. That is where Dave is going. That is where we all must go. And I think there is indeed enough energy naturally flowing in that direction to counter its opposite.
But we can't keep one foot in the boat and one on the dock. There's no voyage without casting off.
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I agree with Johnh:
The only change I would suggest is that the pictured labeled "What we (Americans in general) want" could be changed to show a layman in work clothes just as well. I even think a picture of Jaybird in his daily attire would be great. We just don't want hoods, thugs and trash being pushed in our face and be told it is our fault if we think of them as hoods, thugs and trash.
No matter what color/ethnicity they are.
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I always thought you were better than this, but you just sank to a whole new level stupidity that deserves the distain of all rational thinking people.
What a sad worldview, and how sad it is that you and those like you are committed to keep black america on your plantation of stupidity for generations to come. Too bad a segment of our society is being influence by "leaders" espousing these relics of the past.
I wasn't going to comment on that photo, but Joe said it for me. I can not add to that.
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He's wearing a suit too.
I always thought you were better than this, but you just sank to a whole new level stupidity that deserves the distain of all rational thinking people.
What a sad worldview, and how sad it is that you and those like you are committed to keep black america on your plantation of stupidity for generations to come. Too bad a segment of our society is being influence by "leaders" espousing these relics of the past.
Joe, your aim is off as you are just getting a ricochet. You missed the point entirely.
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Joe, your aim is off as you are just getting a ricochet. You missed the point entirely.
Seriously friend? And I mean I am your friend.
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"If you're not careful, the newspapers will have you hating the people who are being oppressed, and loving the people who are doing the oppressing." - Malcolm X
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He's wearing a suit too.
I always thought you were better than this, but you just sank to a whole new level stupidity that deserves the distain of all rational thinking people.
What a sad worldview, and how sad it is that you and those like you are committed to keep black america on your plantation of stupidity for generations to come. Too bad a segment of our society is being influence by "leaders" espousing these relics of the past.
Some people will continue to see everything in the context of the color of their skin.
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Joe, your aim is off as you are just getting a ricochet. You missed the point entirely.
No I didn't. Your aim is off and was wayyyy off base this time. Dave very clearly articulated what many believe and you chose to post a relic of the past designed to derail the discussion instead of engaging in dialog...shame on you! Screwy Louie, Sharpton and Jackson would be so proud.
Keep stirring the pot like those fools, and civil unrest you so desperately want will indeed happen. The blood of this mess will be on your hands.
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Having said this, there obviously are hold outs to the old fucked up white culture white people have had in the past. There are those that want to cling to ideas of "racial supremacy". It will take time to completely cleanse society of this rubbish and we are working on it. It's pretty obvious is if you really look around and not just at the sensational headlines that this is so.
At the last Sun-N-Fun my wife and I sat at a group table for lunch. There was one guy that began mouthing off about how bad Obama is. I started to engage him in a conversation, but then he went off on how N*****s have ruined the country. He asked what was wrong with the old "separate but equal" rules we used to have? He went on and on and I quickly tuned him out. In a few minutes, I notice that the table was empty except for him, me and my wife. That was when Leslie and I looked at each other and got up to leave. He was still talking to himself as we walked away.
It was sad. There are still people like that. But except between themselves, they are mostly shunned by others. But what really makes me mad is that people still like to use people like that as an example of how things are. That is not how they are. That is how they were. That attitude and belief system is dying and the embers are fading, except when the liberal left attempts to blow hot air on them to revive them.
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It's only January, but I think this qualifies for post of the year.
I too agree that was a great response.
The only change I would suggest is that the pictured labeled "What we (Americans in general) want" could be changed to show a layman in work clothes just as well. I even think a picture of Jaybird in his daily attire would be great. We just don't want hoods, thugs and trash being pushed in our face and be told it is our fault if we think of them as hoods, thugs and trash.
That's not good enough, John. Even if we only called people Hood Rats when they looked like people in Dave's gang banger picture, we will still be accused of being racists because people like Jaybird fail to differentiate between hood rats and "normal" blacks when we make such characterizations. I recall that specifically during the POA debate on the Ferguson riots.
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Joe, your aim is off as you are just getting a ricochet. You missed the point entirely.
No I didn't. Your aim is off and was wayyyy off base this time. Dave very clearly articulated what many believe and you chose to post a relic of the past designed to derail the discussion instead of engaging in dialog...shame on you! Screwy Louie, Sharpton and Jackson would be so proud.
Keep stirring the pot like those fools, and civil unrest you so desperately want will indeed happen. The blood of this mess will be on your hands.
my post was a direct retort to Dave's post. Like this below is also a retort.
PS- Becky, I see you!
(https://scontent.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpf1/v/t1.0-9/553307_10152544596655222_7304444627253323607_n.jpg?oh=5915a9ae17dff19adc845fa5d2d14007&oe=56FCC3F6)
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Joe, your aim is off as you are just getting a ricochet. You missed the point entirely.
No I didn't. Your aim is off and was wayyyy off base this time. Dave very clearly articulated what many believe and you chose to post a relic of the past designed to derail the discussion instead of engaging in dialog...shame on you! Screwy Louie, Sharpton and Jackson would be so proud.
Keep stirring the pot like those fools, and civil unrest you so desperately want will indeed happen. The blood of this mess will be on your hands.
my post was a direct retort to Dave's post. Like this below is also a retort.
PS- Becky, I see you!
(https://scontent.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpf1/v/t1.0-9/553307_10152544596655222_7304444627253323607_n.jpg?oh=5915a9ae17dff19adc845fa5d2d14007&oe=56FCC3F6)
Jaybird, this is not patronizing nor sarcasm. I truly feel sorry for you. I'm sad that you feel the need to carry the yoke of past wrongs, and that you appear to identify with the ghetto thugs that I despise. I don't see how anything can or will ever improve in your otherwise successful life because of these things.
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Joe, your aim is off as you are just getting a ricochet. You missed the point entirely.
No I didn't. Your aim is off and was wayyyy off base this time. Dave very clearly articulated what many believe and you chose to post a relic of the past designed to derail the discussion instead of engaging in dialog...shame on you! Screwy Louie, Sharpton and Jackson would be so proud.
Keep stirring the pot like those fools, and civil unrest you so desperately want will indeed happen. The blood of this mess will be on your hands.
my post was a direct retort to Dave's post. Like this below is also a retort.
PS- Becky, I see you!
(https://scontent.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpf1/v/t1.0-9/553307_10152544596655222_7304444627253323607_n.jpg?oh=5915a9ae17dff19adc845fa5d2d14007&oe=56FCC3F6)
Jaybird,
We all know that for the most part, things suck for blacks. They don't suck as much as they used to, but "suck" is a relative term.
That said, I don't see that your comments are designed to help.
Respect is earned. I think you have the ability to earn the respect of anyone on this board. MLK Jr. earned respect from the white community, even if it was decades late.
Why don't you post more on the accomplishments of black people that have (or should have) earned respect. Post some pictures of the Tuskegee airmen and see what kind of responses you get. I give them more than respect; I give them an incredulous, jaw dropping amount of admiration. Those men took everything that was thrown at them and they excelled.
You are making it very hard for us to even attempt to close the racial gap. Is that what you want?
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He's wearing a suit too.
I always thought you were better than this, but you just sank to a whole new level stupidity that deserves the distain of all rational thinking people.
What a sad worldview, and how sad it is that you and those like you are committed to keep black america on your plantation of stupidity for generations to come. Too bad a segment of our society is being influence by "leaders" espousing these relics of the past.
Jus keepin' it real, yowll.
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Joe, your aim is off as you are just getting a ricochet. You missed the point entirely.
No I didn't. Your aim is off and was wayyyy off base this time. Dave very clearly articulated what many believe and you chose to post a relic of the past designed to derail the discussion instead of engaging in dialog...shame on you! Screwy Louie, Sharpton and Jackson would be so proud.
Keep stirring the pot like those fools, and civil unrest you so desperately want will indeed happen. The blood of this mess will be on your hands.
my post was a direct retort to Dave's post. Like this below is also a retort.
PS- Becky, I see you!
(https://scontent.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpf1/v/t1.0-9/553307_10152544596655222_7304444627253323607_n.jpg?oh=5915a9ae17dff19adc845fa5d2d14007&oe=56FCC3F6)
You are making it very hard for us to even attempt to close the racial gap. Is that what you want?
It's incredulous, but it really seems that's what he wants. That's certainly what I hear from the likes of Louie F.
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(http://www.blacklegalissues.com/img_upld_400/hanging.jpg)
He's wearing a suit too.
Very true. However that is a very old photograph. I even admitted in my post that there are those that believe in racial superiority then and still to this day, but these people are in the decline. We have a ways to go, but progress is happening. Just look around and compare and contrast to the days when that photo was taken.
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my post was a direct retort to Dave's post. Like this below is also a retort.
PS- Becky, I see you!
(https://scontent.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpf1/v/t1.0-9/553307_10152544596655222_7304444627253323607_n.jpg?oh=5915a9ae17dff19adc845fa5d2d14007&oe=56FCC3F6)
Somebody made up that dumb list and it is their opinion as to the attitude of the country, or I suppose white people. It's not some scientific fact that you can point to to prove some point. It's an op-ed and a biased one full of hyperbole at that.
So people troop around with these "Black Lives Matter" signs, block traffic, demonstrate all over the place and for what purpose? To what end? And is it the best use of people's energy?
Let's say the BLM movement is successful beyond it's wildest dreams and a bunch of white and non white cops get locked up for life. How does this advance anything, or help move these people living in these urban hell holes improve their lives?? How does locking up some cops help the babies being born today to escape the ghetto??
Police brutality is real and it exists and it sucks, but it is not what is keeping people in the urban ghettos of America from advancing. Ask your parents, or your grandparents, or read about your great, great grandparents, there is a way out, with or without police brutality. People have done it in the past and are quietly and without any media coverage, or fanfare, doing it today, right now.
There should be mass demonstrations in the urban ghettos with signs that say- "Get Your Shit Together!!"
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Somebody made up that dumb list and it is their opinion as to the attitude of the country, or I suppose white people. It's not some scientific fact that you can point to to prove some point. It's an op-ed and a biased one full of hyperbole at that.
So people troop around with these "Black Lives Matter" signs, block traffic, demonstrate all over the place and for what purpose? To what end? And is it the best use of people's energy?
Let's say the BLM movement is successful beyond it's wildest dreams and a bunch of white and non white cops get locked up for life. How does this advance anything, or help move these people living in these urban hell holes improve their lives?? How does locking up some cops help the babies being born today to escape the ghetto??
Police brutality is real and it exists and it sucks, but it is not what is keeping people in the urban ghettos of America from advancing. Ask your parents, or your grandparents, or read about your great, great grandparents, there is a way out, with or without police brutality. People have done it in the past and are quietly and without any media coverage, or fanfare, doing it today, right now.
There should be mass demonstrations in the urban ghettos with signs that say- "Get Your Shit Together!!"
We all can clearly see that what you describe as hyperbole is the "mainstream" opinion, yet you deny because it doesn't fit into your fantasy view of the world. The only way to change or make anything better is that first one must accurately assess what the current status is, not how they wish it to be. It is the denial of present time, that marries us to the past that you have expressed a desire to put behind you.
And guess what? I'd like to put it in the past too. But it cannot be done because there is suffering in the present and the past is part of the diagnosis and treatment.
You want to take the wind out of the BLM sails, then make their mantra meaningless by proving the point and it's not about locking up cops. If you think that would be the goal, then you're willfully blind to the systemic injustice that makes it possible for there to be the wide gap in perception of justice, which was one of the talking points of the original article. The WaPo author says, "And many of us in the faith community are affirming the theological truth that black lives do matter, because while all human beings are made in the image of God, it is black lives, specifically, that have been devalued in our country — and our social systems must be held accountable." (italics his)
I find it very interesting that in 3 pages of posts, only 2 posts even attempted to address the content of the OP article. The thrust of the article IMO is this line: "And to begin building that beloved community, white Christians must start acting more Christian than white." Deal with it.
IMHO, the failure to deal with it is indicative that a nerve has been struck and we can't even have a decent discussion without the white people getting their panties in a bunch because a black man wants to have a discussion that is critical of white people.
In closing, the article was an exhortation to White Christians to take the vanguard at meaningful societal change. And that's why I posted it. And look what I get in return. Are you telling me that there are no good White Christians among you? Or are you proof that "Too many Americans — particularly Christian Americans of my own generation — continue to worship at the altar of whiteness, defining themselves by their status as members of a temporary and illusory racial majority."
-Peace
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Please forgive my wanton use of the word "you" in the above post. Carry on.
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I wonder if some people think this is a documentary of real life:
http://www.nbc.com/saturday-night-live/video/white-like-me/n9308
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Joe, your aim is off as you are just getting a ricochet. You missed the point entirely.
No I didn't. Your aim is off and was wayyyy off base this time. Dave very clearly articulated what many believe and you chose to post a relic of the past designed to derail the discussion instead of engaging in dialog...shame on you! Screwy Louie, Sharpton and Jackson would be so proud.
Keep stirring the pot like those fools, and civil unrest you so desperately want will indeed happen. The blood of this mess will be on your hands.
my post was a direct retort to Dave's post. Like this below is also a retort.
PS- Becky, I see you!
(https://scontent.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpf1/v/t1.0-9/553307_10152544596655222_7304444627253323607_n.jpg?oh=5915a9ae17dff19adc845fa5d2d14007&oe=56FCC3F6)
Get the fooking chip off your collective shoulders.
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Get the fooking chip off your collective shoulders.
Go home little boy. I think I heard your mama calling you.
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WHITES HAVE JOBS: White privilege
WHITES IN CORPORATE POSITIONS OF POWER: White privilege
feel free to add more...
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Get the fooking chip off your collective shoulders.
Go home little boy. I think I heard your mama calling you.
I'm not the one who is whining about how "unfair" life is.
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In closing, the article was an exhortation to White Christians to take the vanguard at meaningful societal change. And that's why I posted it. And look what I get in return. Are you telling me that there are no good White Christians among you? Or are you proof that "Too many Americans — particularly Christian Americans of my own generation — continue to worship at the altar of whiteness, defining themselves by their status as members of a temporary and illusory racial majority."
-Peace
Another huge pile of horse dung. Damn, it's beginning to skink up in here!!
There remains suffering within black communities, not because of what was done 250 years ago, but rather what has been done in the last 50 years by race hustlers and politicians. Your constant banging of the "it's whitey's fault" drum (and now the "its christian's fault drum) does absolutely nothing to help anyone with black skin. No doubt it makes you, Screwy Louie, Sharpton and other politicians feel powerful an/or useful to the cause, but you are doing nothing but hurting those you claim to want to help.
Money (welfare, food assistance, housing, etc) and special considerations (affirmative action) have not worked, yet in most cases America is being asked to provide more of both to aid blacks. The former has trapped people of all skin colors in poverty. The latter simply is not fair in a society where we are supposed to be all equal.
The most important part of the segregation discussion has to do with the actions of those within the black segment of our society. There is constant demand for equality of outcomes, but yet an ongoing demand for special treatment. Satisfying both is not possible.
Stacey Dash got it right recently, and is not being vilified or destroyed through personal attacks by many people of color... I wonder if those folks need to be less black and more Christian?
http://www.breitbart.com/video/2016/01/20/fncs-stacey-dash-blasts-double-standard-of-oscars-outrage-no-need-for-bet-image-awards/ (http://www.breitbart.com/video/2016/01/20/fncs-stacey-dash-blasts-double-standard-of-oscars-outrage-no-need-for-bet-image-awards/)
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Somebody made up that dumb list and it is their opinion as to the attitude of the country, or I suppose white people. It's not some scientific fact that you can point to to prove some point. It's an op-ed and a biased one full of hyperbole at that.
So people troop around with these "Black Lives Matter" signs, block traffic, demonstrate all over the place and for what purpose? To what end? And is it the best use of people's energy?
Let's say the BLM movement is successful beyond it's wildest dreams and a bunch of white and non white cops get locked up for life. How does this advance anything, or help move these people living in these urban hell holes improve their lives?? How does locking up some cops help the babies being born today to escape the ghetto??
Police brutality is real and it exists and it sucks, but it is not what is keeping people in the urban ghettos of America from advancing. Ask your parents, or your grandparents, or read about your great, great grandparents, there is a way out, with or without police brutality. People have done it in the past and are quietly and without any media coverage, or fanfare, doing it today, right now.
There should be mass demonstrations in the urban ghettos with signs that say- "Get Your Shit Together!!"
We all can clearly see that what you describe as hyperbole is the "mainstream" opinion, yet you deny because it doesn't fit into your fantasy view of the world. The only way to change or make anything better is that first one must accurately assess what the current status is, not how they wish it to be. It is the denial of present time, that marries us to the past that you have expressed a desire to put behind you.
And guess what? I'd like to put it in the past too. But it cannot be done because there is suffering in the present and the past is part of the diagnosis and treatment.
You want to take the wind out of the BLM sails, then make their mantra meaningless by proving the point and it's not about locking up cops. If you think that would be the goal, then you're willfully blind to the systemic injustice that makes it possible for there to be the wide gap in perception of justice, which was one of the talking points of the original article. The WaPo author says, "And many of us in the faith community are affirming the theological truth that black lives do matter, because while all human beings are made in the image of God, it is black lives, specifically, that have been devalued in our country — and our social systems must be held accountable." (italics his)
I find it very interesting that in 3 pages of posts, only 2 posts even attempted to address the content of the OP article. The thrust of the article IMO is this line: "And to begin building that beloved community, white Christians must start acting more Christian than white." Deal with it.
IMHO, the failure to deal with it is indicative that a nerve has been struck and we can't even have a decent discussion without the white people getting their panties in a bunch because a black man wants to have a discussion that is critical of white people.
In closing, the article was an exhortation to White Christians to take the vanguard at meaningful societal change. And that's why I posted it. And look what I get in return. Are you telling me that there are no good White Christians among you? Or are you proof that "Too many Americans — particularly Christian Americans of my own generation — continue to worship at the altar of whiteness, defining themselves by their status as members of a temporary and illusory racial majority."
-Peace
Is that how you should start out a "discussion that is critical of white people" - by figuratively jabbing your black finger in my chest and blaming not only my race but now my religion for what ails your race? I don't know about you, but that approach can get you dropped pretty damned quick.
Yet emboldened by the race hustlers and the Black Lies Matter Movement, that is precisely what you are doing, and yet you are butthurt and offended when we don't buy into your premise, or put a bullet in our brain for not buying into what you seem to believe to be "the truth."
Your article is yet another flawed blame game, and is disgusting. That you buy into it is simply pathetic.
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Stacey Dash is not only hot, but she has her head on straight.
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Joe- I never said it was whitey's fault. That you superimposing your thoughts onto my words.
And since you mentioned Minister Farrakhan pejoratively, I'll let him respond to the thoughts and machination of this and some of the previous posts in this thread (and others):
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Is that how you should start out a "discussion that is critical of white people" - by figuratively jabbing your black finger in my chest and blaming not only my race but now my religion for what ails your race? I don't know about you, but that approach can get you dropped pretty damned quick.
Yet emboldened by the race hustlers and the Black Lies Matter Movement, that is precisely what you are doing, and yet you are butthurt and offended when we don't buy into your premise, or put a bullet in our brain for not buying into what you seem to believe to be "the truth."
Your article is yet another flawed blame game, and is disgusting. That you buy into it is simply pathetic.
I posted the article with no comments of my own. I let the author's words speak for him and didn't say what my opinion of the article was. The response was to go on the offensive in a very un-Christian-like manner and blame everything except to take the opportunity for some introspection. Check your behavior sir. The thread is there for you to review how you and your brethren conduct yourselves.
It's not my place to defend my conduct. That's for you to do and the article asked you to do that, which you haven't done. Confront it. Deal with it. You have asked that I do the same in many of the Islam bashing threads (though my intention or purpose wasn't religion bashing).
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Is that how you should start out a "discussion that is critical of white people" - by figuratively jabbing your black finger in my chest and blaming not only my race but now my religion for what ails your race? I don't know about you, but that approach can get you dropped pretty damned quick.
Yet emboldened by the race hustlers and the Black Lies Matter Movement, that is precisely what you are doing, and yet you are butthurt and offended when we don't buy into your premise, or put a bullet in our brain for not buying into what you seem to believe to be "the truth."
Your article is yet another flawed blame game, and is disgusting. That you buy into it is simply pathetic.
I posted the article with no comments of my own. I let the author's words speak for him and didn't say what my opinion of the article was. The response was to go on the offensive in a very un-Christian-like manner and blame everything except to take the opportunity for some introspection. Check your behavior sir. The thread is there for you to review how you and your brethren conduct yourselves.
It's not my place to defend my conduct. That's for you to do and the article asked you to do that, which you haven't done. Confront it. Deal with it. You have asked that I do the same in many of the Islam bashing threads (though my intention or purpose wasn't religion bashing).
Jaybird, don't piss on my leg and tell me it's raining. :mad:
So fine. Tell us your (previously undisclosed) opinion of the article, and let's see if any of our responses were off base. :rolleyes:
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We all can clearly see that what you describe as hyperbole is the "mainstream" opinion, yet you deny because it doesn't fit into your fantasy view of the world. The only way to change or make anything better is that first one must accurately assess what the current status is, not how they wish it to be. It is the denial of present time, that marries us to the past that you have expressed a desire to put behind you.
And guess what? I'd like to put it in the past too. But it cannot be done because there is suffering in the present and the past is part of the diagnosis and treatment.
I'm not sure who "we all" is, but that list most certainly is hyperbole and gross generalizations. It's "accuracy" only pertains to some people, not everyone. So while the attitudes attributed to white people can be accurate for some white people's actions, so can the attitudes attributed to black people's actions also be accurate some of the time. Like I said, it's a dumb list and actually means nothing , nor does it help anything.
I know I'm supposed to go down that list and say to myself- "Oh wow, that is so true. Gee, I never thought of it like that. Us white people need to work on our perceptions! I feel bad now..." but that's not my reaction to that list. I looked at it and saw truth in all of it and I saw falsehood in all of it. I thought no more of it other than seeing it fro what it is. Blunt agitprop designed to go viral in the internet. About the same intellectual value as a meme, or a cat video for that matter.
Ask yourself this-
- Is life for black people in America better now than 100 years ago?
- Is life for black people in America better now than 50 years ago?
- Over the course of American history, some black people have surely, silently and independently risen up, bettered themselves, improved their lives and position, all the while living under far greater bigotry, racism and police brutality than we have today. How come these successful black people aren't inspiration for all the rest of the black people to do the same?
- Why aren't there more black boys headed for school, vocations and careers rather than prison?
- Why aren't there more black girls headed for school, vocations and careers rather than single mom on welfare?
- Why can't we get black people to believe that black lives matter?
This is not to say that there are no more challenges, or obstacles and that racism, bigotry and oppression no longer exists today. I recognize that they do. Those things have to change with time and we have already done all that can really be done. We have legislation and laws to keep those things in check. Sure there is corruption and those things still happen, but my point is, things are better now than they ever have been with regards to black life in America, the path to success has never been easier. Some blacks rose to success 100 years ago under much worse conditions, so why aren't more doing so now under much easier conditions?
I want to take the wind out of the sails of the BLM movement because I see it sailing around in circles without course, or direction. I see this movement pretty much the same as the "occupy" movement. A bunch of frustrated people demonstrating for something, but they're not exactly sure what it is precisely. Demanding action, but not really sure what that action is supposed to be. Kind of a national "I feel sorry for myself and want somebody to do something about it for me movements".
As to the article in the OP, I don't really feel qualified to comment on that deal because while I am white, I'm not really christian, so if there are white christians that aren't being christian enough for you, I guess you'll have to take that up with them and I would suggest defining more precisely how it is that they are failing in their christianity.
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Joe- I never said it was whitey's fault. That you superimposing your thoughts onto my words.
And since you mentioned Minister Farrakhan pejoratively, I'll let him respond to the thoughts and machination of this and some of the previous posts in this thread (and others):
Nice try Jaybird....I've told you many times I will not listen to the despicable human being in your video. He is a divider, and a hate-filled cretin. There is no point he could possibly make that would have any impact on my belief that he (and others like him) have very intentionally kept black people in a status of victimhood to satisfy his need for power and relevance. He has had numerous opportunities to change his approach and behavior over decades and has failed at every opportunity. Your games are tiring.
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WHITES HAVE JOBS: White privilege
WHITES IN CORPORATE POSITIONS OF POWER: White privilege
feel free to add more...
WHITES SAYING THEY NOTICE CHARACTER, NOT COLOR: Microagression implying the color black is somehow invisible or not important
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WHITES HAVE JOBS: White privilege
WHITES IN CORPORATE POSITIONS OF POWER: White privilege
feel free to add more...
WHITES SAYING THEY NOTICE CHARACTER, NOT COLOR: Microagression implying the color black is somehow invisible or not important
Isn't it sadly funny how Dr King's words are lost on people today?
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I posted because I wanted your (plural) of the article, instead I got your emotional reaction to something in it. I already know how to get black peoples opinions but this is the only place where I can get white folks' unadulterated opinions. Instead, it became a fur ball
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I posted because I wanted your (plural) of the article, instead I got your emotional reaction to something in it. I already know how to get black peoples opinions but this is the only place where I can get white folks' unadulterated opinions. Instead, it became a fur ball
...actually I think it could more accurately be described as a giant bowel movement. Fur ball simply doesn't do this load justice.
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I posted because I wanted your (plural) of the article, instead I got your emotional reaction to something in it. I already know how to get black peoples opinions but this is the only place where I can get white folks' unadulterated opinions. Instead, it became a fur ball
I think you got PRECISELY our unadulterated opinions. That we didn't buy into it is what is giving you butthurt.
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Jaybird, you said you hear me. I said nothing at all furballian. >:(
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I posted because I wanted your (plural) of the article, instead I got your emotional reaction to something in it. I already know how to get black peoples opinions but this is the only place where I can get white folks' unadulterated opinions. Instead, it became a fur ball
If you want our opinions, it would be best to ask for them. Don't just throw out charges and accusations which serve to do little besides put people on the defensive. That is sure to guarantee you get dumped on.
I sympathize with you, but I feel very little responsibility for the Crusades or the KKK. I do as much as I can to try to improve race relations. I just don't see a similar effort on the "other side".
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WTF does "act white" mean?
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I believe Jaybird thinks it means that "Christian" is a set of behaviors imposed by the faith, and "White" is the belief that whites are superior to non-whites. ::)
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I believe Jaybird thinks it means that "Christian" is a set of behaviors imposed by the faith, and "White" is the belief that whites are superior to non-whites. ::)
Why are perpetual racism victims always so racist?
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The difference between Jaybird's view of America and mine, is Jaybird CHOOSES to see everything through a racial lens, and then imputes racism into every topic. That is very much like those who CHOOSE to wallow in whatever challenges life tossed their way, instead of striving to improve their lot, then blaming everyone who CHOSE to improve their lot, for the different outcome.
Life is about choices we make, not choices others make.
Pregnant teenage girls often trap themselves into lifestyles that lead to failure. Sometimes pregnant teenage girls CHOOSE to get an education, find a good job, raise their children to become successful and productive members of society, and everyone wins.
The sooner the racist dog whistle crowd figures that out, the sooner their lives will start to improve.
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The difference between Jaybird's view of America and mine, is Jaybird CHOOSES to see everything through a racial lens, and then imputes racism into every topic. That is very much like those who CHOOSE to wallow in whatever challenges life tossed their way, instead of striving to improve their lot, then blaming everyone who CHOSE to improve their lot, for the different outcome.
Life is about choices we make, not choices others make.
Pregnant teenage girls often trap themselves into lifestyles that lead to failure. Sometimes pregnant teenage girls CHOOSE to get an education, find a good job, raise their children to become successful and productive members of society, and everyone wins.
The sooner the racist dog whistle crowd figures that out, the sooner their lives will start to improve.
There is a great quote from Winston Churchill. "When going through HELL. KEEP GOING!" Meaning, don't wallow, just keep trying. I think that says it all. The problem with some is that they don't have a purpose beyond themselves, and that's what I think we all need. A purpose.
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Off the racial topic for a minute, but I wanted to share some insight that my wife gave me last night.
Occasionally I'll discuss some of our PS (and former SZ) conversations, and last night I mentioned my concern about the apparently growing number of atheists and agnostics in our little pilot group and in the public as a whole. (No need to discuss my concerns about that here - we've done that to death.)
Her hypothesis was that many if not most people today have never wanted for food on the table, a roof overhead, or whether they will live through a World War. My dad's generation had to worry about all of that, and consequently turned to faith for comfort, to give thanks, and to seek forgiveness.
Today's society is more well off and more secure than previous generations, across the board. It might not be rainbows and unicorns for some people, but I think it's safe to say that fewer people have the worries and wants that our parents did. Consequently, fewer people feel the "need" for religion or even faith in general, believing that their own efforts, and not Devine intervention, is what shapes their lives.
Just some top of mind thoughts.
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Off the racial topic for a minute, but I wanted to share some insight that my wife gave me last night.
Occasionally I'll discuss some of our PS (and former SZ) conversations, and last night I mentioned my concern about the apparently growing number of atheists and agnostics in our little pilot group and in the public as a whole. (No need to discuss my concerns about that here - we've done that to death.)
Her hypothesis was that many if not most people today have never wanted for food on the table, a roof overhead, or whether they will live through a World War. My dad's generation had to worry about all of that, and consequently turned to faith for comfort, to give thanks, and to seek forgiveness.
Today's society is more well off and more secure than previous generations, across the board. It might not be rainbows and unicorns for some people, but I think it's safe to say that fewer people have the worries and wants that our parents did. Consequently, fewer people feel the "need" for religion or even faith in general, believing that their own efforts, and not Devine intervention, is what shapes their lives.
Just some top of mind thoughts.
We now worship at the altar of High Technology. "Garmin is my co-pilot."
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Off the racial topic for a minute, but I wanted to share some insight that my wife gave me last night.
Occasionally I'll discuss some of our PS (and former SZ) conversations, and last night I mentioned my concern about the apparently growing number of atheists and agnostics in our little pilot group and in the public as a whole. (No need to discuss my concerns about that here - we've done that to death.)
Her hypothesis was that many if not most people today have never wanted for food on the table, a roof overhead, or whether they will live through a World War. My dad's generation had to worry about all of that, and consequently turned to faith for comfort, to give thanks, and to seek forgiveness.
Today's society is more well off and more secure than previous generations, across the board. It might not be rainbows and unicorns for some people, but I think it's safe to say that fewer people have the worries and wants that our parents did. Consequently, fewer people feel the "need" for religion or even faith in general, believing that their own efforts, and not Devine intervention, is what shapes their lives.
Just some top of mind thoughts.
I can't say that I disagree, but I would add - The social construct in the modern age (millennials, public school teacher unions, and the like) is all about conformity to a social order that permits very little individuality. Even thinking logically is frowned upon and frequently punished. The more self-centered any society grows, the more likely society is as a whole to abandon anything that fails to prop up the order of the day, which is all about obeying, and coloring inside the lines, ignoring the temptation to dream, excel, reach, or strive for a better outcome.
That Bernie Sanders - Hilary Clinton are the best the far left can put forth, is proof that individualism is being beaten out of our younger generation.
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Off the racial topic for a minute, but I wanted to share some insight that my wife gave me last night.
Occasionally I'll discuss some of our PS (and former SZ) conversations, and last night I mentioned my concern about the apparently growing number of atheists and agnostics in our little pilot group and in the public as a whole. (No need to discuss my concerns about that here - we've done that to death.)
Her hypothesis was that many if not most people today have never wanted for food on the table, a roof overhead, or whether they will live through a World War. My dad's generation had to worry about all of that, and consequently turned to faith for comfort, to give thanks, and to seek forgiveness.
Today's society is more well off and more secure than previous generations, across the board. It might not be rainbows and unicorns for some people, but I think it's safe to say that fewer people have the worries and wants that our parents did. Consequently, fewer people feel the "need" for religion or even faith in general, believing that their own efforts, and not Devine intervention, is what shapes their lives.
Just some top of mind thoughts.
You and your wife have some excellent insights. I agree. Where there is strife, there is faith. We replaced God with Government, and replaced working towards being American with hyphens. Branches from the same tree.
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Somebody made up that dumb list and it is their opinion as to the attitude of the country, or I suppose white people. It's not some scientific fact that you can point to to prove some point. It's an op-ed and a biased one full of hyperbole at that.
So people troop around with these "Black Lives Matter" signs, block traffic, demonstrate all over the place and for what purpose? To what end? And is it the best use of people's energy?
Let's say the BLM movement is successful beyond it's wildest dreams and a bunch of white and non white cops get locked up for life. How does this advance anything, or help move these people living in these urban hell holes improve their lives?? How does locking up some cops help the babies being born today to escape the ghetto??
Police brutality is real and it exists and it sucks, but it is not what is keeping people in the urban ghettos of America from advancing. Ask your parents, or your grandparents, or read about your great, great grandparents, there is a way out, with or without police brutality. People have done it in the past and are quietly and without any media coverage, or fanfare, doing it today, right now.
There should be mass demonstrations in the urban ghettos with signs that say- "Get Your Shit Together!!"
Daymond John is a perfect example and should be a beacon to those living in the "hood".
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It's incredulous, but it really seems that's what he wants. That's certainly what I hear from the likes of Louie F.
I agree completely.
For folks like Sharpton and Jackson, there is money ( not as much perhaps, but plenty) to be made off of pushing the phony racial hatred theme. Certainly Sharpton has no real talents, or he would have found a way to do so without prostituting himself on the altar of stupidity, again, and again, and again - like say, "Resist we much!"
In an age when the president is black, and throughout our government, there are far more blacks holding high appointed and elected office than 13%, the idea that racism is the great problem is a fantasy spread by delusional, angry, unfulfilled, whiners.
Just because you can't find a real occupation, is no reason we should all have to listen to your insufferable, racist babbling.
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Well said Number7.