PILOT SPIN
Spin Zone => Spin Zone => Topic started by: Little Joe on April 30, 2017, 01:16:35 PM
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Where'd he go?
I was just getting used to him.
He wasn't too bad for a liberal. ;)
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He's lurking.
I think he figured it out people were seeing through his bullshit.
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Not a bad guy, but kinda typical for a progressive.
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Not a bad guy, but kinda typical for a progressive.
True. Never understood why progressives try to portray themselves as something they are not.
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I hope he decides to stick around. It's nice having a differing viewpoint to actually have a debate about. I wish some of the other members would come back as well.
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True. Never understood why progressives try to portray themselves as something they are not.
We're not a progressive echo chamber and there's no lesbian moderator to shut down any thoughts that stray off the plantation.
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We're not a progressive echo chamber and there's no lesbian moderator to shut down any thoughts that stray off the plantation.
Yeah, we are a conservative circle jerk, but we cant even agree with other either.
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Yeah, we are a conservative circle jerk, but we cant even agree with other either.
Yep.
Imagine the atrocity of adults refusing to agree...
It's a liberal nightmare here where free thought runs amok.
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Yeah, we are a conservative circle jerk, but we cant even agree with other either.
(http://cdn.groovyhistory.com/content/34056/e5349f2680c34bf009ab8c492448eb52.jpg)
1960's era progressive 'freedom' meeting.
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Yeah, we are a conservative circle jerk, but we cant even agree with other either.
It is OK to disagree. We are not all conservatives, Libertarians, nor Republicans. Some of us are a mixture of all three, any many of us disagree with the mainstream/establishment Republicans including myself. I think the reason we do not have many liberal/progressives, and they typically argue with emotion, not facts, so their arguments can be easily dismissed. There are a few that can make their points well, and it is good to hear other views, and opinions. I may disagree with them, but appreciate a different perspective. I welcome more discussion with those whom I disagree. They too deserve a voice, and outlet.
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It is OK to disagree. We are not all conservatives, Libertarians, nor Republicans. Some of us are a mixture of all three, any many of us disagree with the mainstream/establishment Republicans including myself. I think the reason we do not have many liberal/progressives, and they typically argue with emotion, not facts, so their arguments can be easily dismissed. There are a few that can make their points well, and it is good to hear other views, and opinions. I may disagree with them, but appreciate a different perspective. I welcome more discussion with those whom I disagree. They too deserve a voice, and outlet.
I think, at least in part, it's because some members here have essentially run off other members by insulting them and denigrating them for having different views. It's hard to have an honest exchange of ideas when one person is constantly calling you names because you disagree with them. It doesn't encourage people to participate.
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I think, at least in part, it's because some members here have essentially run off other members by insulting them and denigrating them for having different views. It's hard to have an honest exchange of ideas when one person is constantly calling you names because you disagree with them. It doesn't encourage people to participate.
It also doesn't encourage an honest exchange of ideas when the other person is totally bullshitting and making shit up to back their position.
Those that "get run off" have done it to themselves as they are either too thin skin, or they try to perpetuate an argument that makes no sense, or is simply the latest liberal talking points.
The libs that fled here after the election did so because they had nothing. All of their positions were just as flawed as their party and candidate. They anxiously anticipated a Hillary victory so they could rub our noses in it and when that didn't happen..........
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It also doesn't encourage an honest exchange of ideas when the other person is totally bullshitting and making shit up to back their position.
Those that "get run off" have done it to themselves as they are either too thin skin, or they try to perpetuate an argument that makes no sense, or is simply the latest liberal talking points.
The libs that fled here after the election did so because they had nothing. All of their positions were just as flawed as their party and candidate. They anxiously anticipated a Hillary victory so they could rub our noses in it and when that didn't happen..........
You're justifying people being insulted because their arguments don't add up? Let people have whatever argument they want, it'll either stand on its merits or it won't. There's no need to put people down because they don't think the same as you or anyone else. They didn't run themselves off, they were run off by the insults. It's one thing to call someone out on a bad argument, it's another to insult them.
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You're justifying people being insulted because their arguments don't add up?
Nope.
Let people have whatever argument they want, it'll either stand on its merits or it won't.
Didn't I just state the similar thing? Their arguments don't stand up when it's nothing more than liberal talking points or fabricated stories.
There's no need to put people down because they don't think the same as you or anyone else.
So is it "putting someone down" when they get called out for using bullshit talking points or a very easily noticed fabrication?
They didn't run themselves off, they were run off by the insults. It's one thing to call someone out on a bad argument, it's another to insult them.
Should we start a sub forum for the snow flakes so they can have a safe space?
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Nope.
Didn't I just state the similar thing? Their arguments don't stand up when it's nothing more than liberal talking points or fabricated stories.
So is it "putting someone down" when they get called out for using bullshit talking points or a very easily noticed fabrication?
Should we start a sub forum for the snow flakes so they can have a safe space?
It's pretty simple. Argue the points they submit rather than calling them names. It's not productive to the exchange of ideas when one person is constantly calling the other person names. It has nothing to do with snowflakes and needing another forum. The snowflake mentality is for those who can't deal with reality and get offended by other's ideas and ways of life. I wouldn't want to engage in a debate with someone if I was constantly called names, either, and that's not because I'm a snowflake but because the other person obviously doesn't care what I have to say, so why waste my time?
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It's pretty simple. Argue the points they submit rather than calling them names. It's not productive to the exchange of ideas when one person is constantly calling the other person names. It has nothing to do with snowflakes and needing another forum. The snowflake mentality is for those who can't deal with reality and get offended by other's ideas and ways of life. I wouldn't want to engage in a debate with someone if I was constantly called names, either, and that's not because I'm a snowflake but because the other person obviously doesn't care what I have to say, so why waste my time?
Everyone has a choice here.
"If you can't stand the heat, get out of the kitchen".
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Everyone has a choice here.
"If you can't stand the heat, get out of the kitchen".
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It's not that I can't stand the heat. I just don't enjoy the hatred. And when it comes from "My side of the Isle" it is embarrassing.
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It's not that I can't stand the heat. I just don't enjoy the hatred. And when it comes from "My side of the Isle" it is embarrassing.
I don't believe in name calling, nor insulting people. However, I believe there is an ignore function here where a poster can ignore those that insult, or annoy them. Nobody is forcing someone to read all the posts, nor forcing them to read insulting posts. In reality, insults, and name calling are a very small percentage of posts. The lions share of posts, and posters are not aggravating.
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Republicans are individuals and thus may not all have the same view on a subject. The Democrats march in lock step with the leadership.
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I don't believe in name calling, nor insulting people. However, I believe there is an ignore function here where a poster can ignore those that insult, or annoy them. Nobody is forcing someone to read all the posts, nor forcing them to read insulting posts. In reality, insults, and name calling are a very small percentage of posts. The lions share of posts, and posters are not aggravating.
You are right. There are just a few people that are aggravating. And i submit that those few people are part of the reason there are not more people posting here
The ignore for nction is not the way to make it better.
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You are right. There are just a few people that are aggravating. And i submit that those few people are part of the reason there are not more people posting here
The ignore for nction is not the way to make it better.
Well, the ignore function is a quick fix, or better yet, just don't read certain posts, or threads. I don't use the ignore function, but for some it may be useful, but you are correct, it doesn't make the board better as a whole. If you are recommending moderators to make the forum "better", (I'm not sure you are), be careful what you wish for, as we've seen on past aviation forums where it did get too heavy handed, and thus made the forum less appealing for many.
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Well, the ignore function is a quick fix, or better yet, just don't read certain posts, or threads. I don't use the ignore function, but for some it may be useful, but you are correct, it doesn't make the board better as a whole. If you are recommending moderators to make the forum "better", (I'm not sure you are), be careful what you wish for, as we've seen on past aviation forums where it did get too heavy handed, and thus made the forum less appealing for many.
I'm not sure if moderators are necessary since we have such a small community, but I would like to see a reduction in the personal attacks on people for having different viewpoints. I'm also not suggesting we start forming all kinds of rules, either. I would like to think people can engage on issues rather than personal attacks. But, this is the internet, so there's that.
I think some members would stick around and be more active if they weren't attacked for their views. Steingar just said in the immigration thread that he'd like to stop posting here. I'd like to know why. I don't agree with him on most everything, but it's nice having his viewpoint here.
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Well, the ignore function is a quick fix, or better yet, just don't read certain posts, or threads. I don't use the ignore function, but for some it may be useful, but you are correct, it doesn't make the board better as a whole. If you are recommending moderators to make the forum "better", (I'm not sure you are), be careful what you wish for, as we've seen on past aviation forums where it did get too heavy handed, and thus made the forum less appealing for many.
No, I"m definitely not advocating moderators. I am advocating self restraint and peer pressure.
My problem with the ignore function is that it doesn't serve my purpose. It is not ME that is (usually) being insulted, and when it is, I can take it. Or I can leave. I can't force a liberal to ignore an idiot of a different viewpoint. Nor do I want to.
But the Spin Zone has so much potential to be a place where we can share ideas, learn from each other, argue and discuss politics. A few people on this board enjoy being caustic and running off those with differing ideas, and we all suffer for that. This board was getting real sleepy. Nudnik showed up and the place picked up and there were some good discussions. Now, I don't know if he is just taking a break or if he decided it isn't worth the battle, but since he quit posting, the place has gotten boring again.
Haven't heard much from Asechrest lately either. Or Gary.
Coming here now is like going to a team scrimmage instead of a real game with opponents.
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It is remarkably apparent that when progressives insult conservatives there is no backlash of members whining about insults.
It is just the way it is.
When a conservative treats a progressive exactly as they are treated, there is no end of the pathetic snowflake responses backed up by calls for restraint.
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I'm not sure if moderators are necessary since we have such a small community, but I would like to see a reduction in the personal attacks on people for having different viewpoints. I'm also not suggesting we start forming all kinds of rules, either. I would like to think people can engage on issues rather than personal attacks. But, this is the internet, so there's that.
I think some members would stick around and be more active if they weren't attacked for their views. Steingar just said in the immigration thread that he'd like to stop posting here. I'd like to know why. I don't agree with him on most everything, but it's nice having his viewpoint here.
I'd like think it's because Steingar regularly gets his butt handed to him, but I'm sure he doesn't see it that way. As far as the name calling and the ad hominem, I really think it detracts from the poster's argument or point, if there is one, to the degree that I usually ignore the offending post. I try not to do it (not always successful) other than using the terms liberal or progressive which are not denigrating terms in my opinion.
No moderators.
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It is remarkably apparent that when progressives insult conservatives there is no backlash of members whining about insults.
It is just the way it is.
When a conservative treats a progressive exactly as they are treated, there is no end of the pathetic snowflake responses backed up by calls for restraint.
I'm pretty sure you can take it, they definitely can't take it. I can't think of any recent name calling by progressives, can you point a few out for me, maybe I'm not paying enough attention.
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I'm mostly just buried with life, not purposely avoiding posting. I'm long-winded so I haven't been able to get real involved with conversations lately. If I had more time, I would post, since I'm typically right and most of you are typically wrong, especially that Liberal Number7.
I also just purchased my latest project (read: stupid impulse buy) - a Spanish-made 50cc sport bike in terrible condition that I will attempt to refurbish buying parts from Ebay UK. ;D This is what it should look like:
(http://raresportbikesforsale.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/Screen-Shot-2011-08-01-at-8.57.16-PM.png)
And this is what mine looks like:
https://www.instagram.com/p/BTkNimCAMxy/
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I also just purchased my latest project (read: stupid impulse buy) - a Spanish-made 50cc sport bike in terrible condition that I will attempt to refurbish buying parts from Ebay UK. ;D This is what it should look like:
(http://raresportbikesforsale.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/Screen-Shot-2011-08-01-at-8.57.16-PM.png)
Since you had the good sense to turn this into a bike thread, I'll add my own little Italian bike:
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/DEGRsNg4_qpf8pSQuquJlB7AYHYCwcuVSnJmQrEP8VQceXOOqi6_NPRnVBgvfFn2JqQuOKu3ovm_IHAk4Fdh2Fr8ywB02PjyvdZ7BuAdR3H7vFNkeLDbkwBlLYO0qAXui_MwF6-DZfT7Krpqf9w5ZT74FiGdCOXlxlFUHQpDkqFa968otLSD0LctTnTGketQBvzeWfCELlWjjiqvHIygNweurq9N9GY1L5cAEZ_B2yw2GKOYKtb5gJMHha0cwp7M8_QgD2PqkP6gnVwlCAmCuf4GOMj6OEBhIo2Y4-peDWqH8bZJxHdpfWyWUfHh_0zLv_eaxOTDYyJcV475dJZnD550SHYSxmXnhn3FPkylD275iDFW-3Ruj1cbur5x_LaKwCiLFWqZuA88Txte4fpU8B60l3G2mF5xsEHU7EmZGAwTujlc6lGemQt27j620M7Ux0nucjk5SGmdvmQMifo-QALIs7QAqYM9jMI0XialeA7XgrzsOJXn-mYYSp9z9bWL6yN-LAg4GO63t2X2BoN_nFMbXQZv-BRvlUFEL7L8Cbm8Ze7j9ZNNy5_regJRRCtcLGGBPxbVEWbmjgm68LUFMLH7uR5PVlXzxvj37ixZWXxFaYanIDJc=w790-h592-no)
And good on you for restoring such a classic. I'm such a ham-fisted mechanic that I couldn't even keep my Goldwing going, and it was from the 80s.
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I also just purchased my latest project (read: stupid impulse buy) - a Spanish-made 50cc sport bike in terrible condition that I will attempt to refurbish buying parts from Ebay UK.
You meant to say 500cc sport bike.......right? :)
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You meant to say 500cc sport bike.......right? :)
Naw, I"m sure he meant 50. Remember, he is a woosie liberal that couldn't handle a 500 cc bike. ;)
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Since you had the good sense to turn this into a bike thread, I'll add my own little Italian bike:
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/DEGRsNg4_qpf8pSQuquJlB7AYHYCwcuVSnJmQrEP8VQceXOOqi6_NPRnVBgvfFn2JqQuOKu3ovm_IHAk4Fdh2Fr8ywB02PjyvdZ7BuAdR3H7vFNkeLDbkwBlLYO0qAXui_MwF6-DZfT7Krpqf9w5ZT74FiGdCOXlxlFUHQpDkqFa968otLSD0LctTnTGketQBvzeWfCELlWjjiqvHIygNweurq9N9GY1L5cAEZ_B2yw2GKOYKtb5gJMHha0cwp7M8_QgD2PqkP6gnVwlCAmCuf4GOMj6OEBhIo2Y4-peDWqH8bZJxHdpfWyWUfHh_0zLv_eaxOTDYyJcV475dJZnD550SHYSxmXnhn3FPkylD275iDFW-3Ruj1cbur5x_LaKwCiLFWqZuA88Txte4fpU8B60l3G2mF5xsEHU7EmZGAwTujlc6lGemQt27j620M7Ux0nucjk5SGmdvmQMifo-QALIs7QAqYM9jMI0XialeA7XgrzsOJXn-mYYSp9z9bWL6yN-LAg4GO63t2X2BoN_nFMbXQZv-BRvlUFEL7L8Cbm8Ze7j9ZNNy5_regJRRCtcLGGBPxbVEWbmjgm68LUFMLH7uR5PVlXzxvj37ixZWXxFaYanIDJc=w790-h592-no)
And good on you for restoring such a classic. I'm such a ham-fisted mechanic that I couldn't even keep my Goldwing going, and it was from the 80s.
Nice! I'm not much of a mechanic, but this one's a 2-stroke single-cylinder engine that hasn't been imported to the states for years and with seemingly no US-based parts distributors, so how tough could it be? ;D I've got a 2-stroke jet ski from '95 right next to it. Kind of fond of two strokes ever since my jet ski project.
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You meant to say 500cc sport bike.......right? :)
Nope, I meant 50cc! Remember I'm a woosie Liberal.
European countries have a thriving market for small-displacement sport bikes because young drivers are not allowed to drive large-displacement bikes. Derbi has been around since 1922 and specializes in the small-displacement market, winning many Grand Prix championships over the years.
This model is a 2002 "Replica", designed to replicate their racing models. It has a 2-stroke 49cc liquid cooled single-cylinder engine. It is a fully-geared six speed. I've never even driven a motorcycle before, so in addition to an interesting if not tough restoration project, I can hopefully learn to ride without fear of a throttle blip sending the front wheel over my head.
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Nope, I meant 50cc! Remember I'm a woosie Liberal.
European countries have a thriving market for small-displacement sport bikes because young drivers are not allowed to drive large-displacement bikes. Derbi has been around since 1922 and specializes in the small-displacement market, winning many Grand Prix championships over the years.
This model is a 2002 "Replica", designed to replicate their racing models. It has a 2-stroke 49cc liquid cooled single-cylinder engine. It is a fully-geared six speed. I've never even driven a motorcycle before, so in addition to an interesting if not tough restoration project, I can hopefully learn to ride without fear of a throttle blip sending the front wheel over my head.
I was kidding. My first Honda was a 1971 Z50 Mini Trail, 50cc dirt bike. It was a 4 stroke however. And, yeah, I was 11 years old. :) A few year later I upgraded to a 70cc, then 250, then...........
Looks like a cool project, and a blast to ride! Keep us posted.
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Nope, I meant 50cc! Remember I'm a woosie Liberal.
European countries have a thriving market for small-displacement sport bikes because young drivers are not allowed to drive large-displacement bikes. Derbi has been around since 1922 and specializes in the small-displacement market, winning many Grand Prix championships over the years.
This model is a 2002 "Replica", designed to replicate their racing models. It has a 2-stroke 49cc liquid cooled single-cylinder engine. It is a fully-geared six speed. I've never even driven a motorcycle before, so in addition to an interesting if not tough restoration project, I can hopefully learn to ride without fear of a throttle blip sending the front wheel over my head.
First thing I would do is pop that 50 cc motor out and drop in a 125cc. More power er, er, er.
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I've never even driven a motorcycle before, so in addition to an interesting if not tough restoration project, I can hopefully learn to ride without fear of a throttle blip sending the front wheel over my head.
If you've never before ridden, learn on a cheap 250 Ninja, or a Honda Rebel, or some small displacement bike of similar ilk. Don't learn on a one of a kind restoration project that could be badly damaged in a spill.
Small bikes are freely available in most marketplaces, economically priced, and easily sold, since everyone likes using them to learn to ride. Learn on something you don't have to worry about before you start showing off your project.
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If you've never before ridden, learn on a cheap 250 Ninja, or a Honda Rebel, or some small displacement bike of similar ilk. Don't learn on a one of a kind restoration project that could be badly damaged in a spill.
Small bikes are freely available in most marketplaces, economically priced, and easily sold, since everyone likes using them to learn to ride. Learn on something you don't have to worry about before you start showing off your project.
I believe his goal is to restore the bike, as a hobby, not learning to ride. Learning to ride is a side benefit.
The bike I learned on was a 50cc Sears unit that was held together with dryer tape and glue. The good thing was the it could never get me to the scene of an accident on time.
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I believe his goal is to restore the bike, as a hobby, not learning to ride. Learning to ride is a side benefit.
I gathered that, but I think it folly to subject a gorgeous rebuilt classic to the rigors of training. Better to guy a small bike for not much, learn on it, and sell it for not much. Then ride the restoration to bike shows and whatnot.
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I gathered that, but I think it folly to subject a gorgeous rebuilt classic to the rigors of training. Better to guy a small bike for not much, learn on it, and sell it for not much. Then ride the restoration to bike shows and whatnot.
The bike is a mess. Many of the fairings will need to be repaired or replaced, and I'll definitely be repainting. The original seat is gone. The electrical system is in shambles and the wiring harness is in my trunk. The tach is busted. I'm fairly sure parts are missing. There was a balled-up sock over an opening toward the back of the engine - not even sure what that is yet. There's a 2-liter coke bottle cap on the coolant tank fill opening. The windshield is shattered. The clutch handle is held on by a zip-tie.
I was able to find a PDF parts list and a repair manual. Some OEM parts are available, mostly from overseas suppliers, but many are no longer available.
Anyway, if I can fix the guts of it, I could practice riding a bit before doing the fit-and-finish stuff. Then if I drop it it's not as dire. I am a bit torn on bikes. I've always wanted a sport bike but my county is incredibly dense and full of old folks. It is _dangerous_ to ride here. But I would like to learn to ride just so I can say I know how.
Oh, another issue that made this a stupid impulse buy: no title (guy is "looking for it at his Mom's house"). Luckily I got it dirt cheap, and I did get a bill of sale and copies of the guy's license. I'm going to have the sheriff's office look up the VIN to be sure it's not stolen. Not sure yet the process to get it titled, if I even can. If I can't title it not sure what I'll do. Track bike? =P
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The bike is a mess.
Big Snip.
Oh, another issue that made this a stupid impulse buy: no title (guy is "looking for it at his Mom's house"). Luckily I got it dirt cheap, and I did get a bill of sale and copies of the guy's license. I'm going to have the sheriff's office look up the VIN to be sure it's not stolen. Not sure yet the process to get it titled, if I even can. If I can't title it not sure what I'll do. Track bike? =P
You are a better man than me. That is quite the project. Had I known, could of done you a good deal on a '77 Yamaha 650. Finally bit the bullet and sold it a while ago. Fun bike, but wasn't riding it that much, needed some work that I just didn't have the time or desire to tackle.
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You are a better man than me. That is quite the project. Had I known, could of done you a good deal on a '77 Yamaha 650. Finally bit the bullet and sold it a while ago. Fun bike, but wasn't riding it that much, needed some work that I just didn't have the time or desire to tackle.
Was that the upright twin engine, Triumph copy? I was considering one in 1981, and found a slightly used 1978 Triumph 750 Bonneville at a good price so sold my Yamaha XT250, and bought it.
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Was that the upright twin engine, Triumph copy? I was considering one in 1981, and found a slightly used 1978 Triumph 750 Bonneville at a good price so sold my Yamaha XT250, and bought it.
Yep! Very similar design. Solid, reliable engine. Had a lot of fun with it, sorry to see it go.
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Yep! Very similar design. Solid, reliable engine. Had a lot of fun with it, sorry to see it go.
I sold my bikes when I started flying in 1994. Last summer, after not having ridden for several years, I took the PennDot Motorcycle Safety Course with a friend who had just bought an older Honda 750 Nighthawk. My intent was maybe to get a newer Triumph (used, but the newer iteration, not a vintage bike). I was either going to get a Thruxton version (already CAFE'd), or a Bonne, and do it piecemeal myself. (was leaning towards the latter to save $$$)
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You are a better man than me. That is quite the project. Had I known, could of done you a good deal on a '77 Yamaha 650. Finally bit the bullet and sold it a while ago. Fun bike, but wasn't riding it that much, needed some work that I just didn't have the time or desire to tackle.
I don't have the time, either. But I'm a sucker for projects. It's a character flaw.
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My bike is going to the mechanic to get some armor. Frame and engine sliders, spools for the front and rear wheels. Instructions said to take it to a mechanic so I will. Good enough excuse I guess. And I may be getting my airplane back this weekend!
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First thing I would do is pop that 50 cc motor out and drop in a 125cc. More power er, er, er.
Derbi does make a 125cc, but no clue if it fits. Hmmm.
Also why the hell was a balled up sock covering an outlet at the back of the engine? I don't even know what that outlet is, yet.
Oh, I guess it's where this microphone-looking thing is:
(http://www.apriliaforum.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=169411&stc=1&thumb=1&d=1314170723)
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And I may be getting my airplane back this weekend!
Well... THAT is good news!! :)
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Derbi does make a 125cc, but no clue if it fits. Hmmm.
Also why the hell was a balled up sock covering an outlet at the back of the engine? I don't even know what that outlet is, yet.
Oh, I guess it's where this microphone-looking thing is:
(http://www.apriliaforum.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=169411&stc=1&thumb=1&d=1314170723)
Usually they bolt right in. You would have to check it out. That "sock covering" is the air cleaner on the intake to the carb, or that one could be fuel injected.
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Usually they bolt right in. You would have to check it out. That "sock covering" is the air cleaner on the intake to the carb, or that one could be fuel injected.
You're right. I was just staring at that engine and thinking through the combustion process and went "duh, that's the air inlet".
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And I may be getting my airplane back this weekend!
Excellent! I hope you get to fly it and it's every bit enjoyable as you remember it. Mooneys are awesome.
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Indeed they are. We'll see, the forecast is for IFR wx this weekend. We've a good forecast for early next week, so perhaps I'll play hoockey one day.
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My next plane may be a M20C, or M20E. I don't mind the amputee back seats, as most of the time I use them for bags anyway. Having a Johnson bar version would be nice too. Hope you can get to fly her Michael! Pics if you can please!
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My next plane may be a M20C, or M20E. I don't mind the amputee back seats, as most of the time I use them for bags anyway. Having a Johnson bar version would be nice too. Hope you can get to fly her Michael! Pics if you can please!
I've gotten 3 full adults into my Mooney with no issues. The guy in the backseat wasn't that cramped because the seats move so far forward. The Johnson bar is nice because you don't have to worry about electric gear failing and it's quick to just put the gear up or down.
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I wanted the short body Mooney specifically for two reasons. The first was the small back seat. I can count on the fingers of one hand the number of times I've really needed a back seat. Why pay for and haul a big one around that I'm not going to use? I'd feel different had I Steinspawn, but I don't.
The second was the Johnson bar. Like the man said, no motors to break, or inspect. No seals to leak, either. One does have to replace doughnuts from time to time, but they aren't that bad. Ruptured one on my bad landing.
And of course, the main reason was Mooneys are one of the most efficient GA airplanes. I like flying fast.
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And of course, the main reason was Mooneys are one of the most efficient GA airplanes. I like flying fast.
That's the reason I replaced my Cherokee with the Tiger. Much more efficient, and much faster. I'd probably pick up another ten knots in the M20C, as the Tiger is a 130 - 135 KTAS plane (65% - 75% power) at altitude. Can you get a decent IFR equipped M20C for $40k?
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That's the reason I replaced my Cherokee with the Tiger. Much more efficient, and much faster. I'd probably pick up another ten knots in the M20C, as the Tiger is a 130 - 135 KTAS plane (65% - 75% power) at altitude. Can you get a decent IFR equipped M20C for $40k?
Define "decent IFR equipped." I bought mine with a KNS-80 RNAV (and DME), 2 VORs (one with glide slope), two NAV/COMMs and no IFR GPS (has a Garmin GPSMap 396 VFR GPS) for well under $40k. I can do an ILS, Localizer and VOR approach on mine.
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That's the reason I replaced my Cherokee with the Tiger. Much more efficient, and much faster. I'd probably pick up another ten knots in the M20C, as the Tiger is a 130 - 135 KTAS plane (65% - 75% power) at altitude. Can you get a decent IFR equipped M20C for $40k?
Like the man said, define "decently equipped". Mine came with VOR, DME, and ADS, which was decently equipped in 1980. Getting one with a good IFR GPS in that price range can be done, but will be tricky.
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Define "decent IFR equipped." I bought mine with a KNS-80 RNAV (and DME), 2 VORs (one with glide slope), two NAV/COMMs and no IFR GPS (has a Garmin GPSMap 396 VFR GPS) for well under $40k. I can do an ILS, Localizer and VOR approach on mine.
Well a WAAS 430 or 530 would be great, but I understand that means more $$$. With today's non-IFR rated technology, can you safely get by with the above? Obviously, you can, or you wouldn't be doing it. I wouldn't be doing a lot of hard IFR, just haze, and layer stuff.
The other route for me would be to buy an RV-7, or similar someone has already built, but that's more $$$ still.
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Well a WAAS 430 or 530 would be great, but I understand that means more $$$. With today's non-IFR rated technology, can you safely get by with the above? Obviously, you can, or you wouldn't be doing it.
The other route for me would be to buy an RV-7, or similar someone has already built, but that's more $$$ still.
You may be able to find one with a 430W, it just may take you a while to look for one. As for flying without the 430W and doing it safely, yes you can and I do it all the time (I don't file). I also have ForeFlight with a Stratus 2 which adds to the safety margin with ADS-B and radar. If you don't think you'll upgrade your avionics in the future, hold out and find the one you want now. There's a lot of great deals on M20C's and E's, it's just a matter of what you're looking for.
If you haven't already, check out http://www.mooneyspace.com. They're an excellent community and resource for Mooneys. They also have a section for people to sell their aircraft.
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Well a WAAS 430 or 530 would be great, but I understand that means more $$$. With today's non-IFR rated technology, can you safely get by with the above? Obviously, you can, or you wouldn't be doing it. I wouldn't be doing a lot of hard IFR, just haze, and layer stuff.
Most of the M20c's and M20e's that I saw had older GPS equipment if they were equipped at all. I've yet to see one in that price range with a 430 that didn't have big problems.
The other route for me would be to buy an RV-7, or similar someone has already built, but that's more $$$ still.
The thought of Flying IFR with something that responsive leaves me a bit cold. I know its been done, but I doubt I could do it. I'll be lucky if I can get the IR in the Mooney.
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The thought of Flying IFR with something that responsive leaves me a bit cold. I know its been done, but I doubt I could do it. I'll be lucky if I can get the IR in the Mooney.
You won't have an issue with that. It'll just take some practice, like with anything else.
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You won't have an issue with that. It'll just take some practice, like with anything else.
People said that about the Tiger also. In fact, I walked into the Bellanca shop on my field, and all the A&P's laughed at me when I said I was going to fly the Tiger for IFR training. They were pushing me to sell it, and buy a Viking. ;D
The M20C seems to be the best bang for the buck in that class right now.
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You won't have an issue with that. It'll just take some practice, like with anything else.
Hope so. Once I get my airplane back its going to be treated to a KLN94 and an ADSB transponder. If I can scrape together the bucks I'll start training. Being scientist I'm used to seeing the world through instruments. That said I've been a VFR pilot for 16 years. I suspect I've picked up a LOT of bad habits.
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People said that about the Tiger also. In fact, I walked into the Bellanca shop on my field, and all the A&P's laughed at me when I said I was going to fly the Tiger for IFR training. They were pushing me to sell it, and buy a Viking. ;D
The M20C seems to be the best bang for the buck in that class right now.
It is. It's hard to beat 140kts on 8GPH. The annuals are cheap (squawks excepted) and it's a traveling machine. It'll certainly expand your weekend flying since it's fast and being so fuel efficient means it won't cost you a lot to fly further, fill up and return home.
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Hope so. Once I get my airplane back its going to be treated to a KLN94 and an ADSB transponder. If I can scrape together the bucks I'll start training. Being scientist I'm used to seeing the world through instruments. That said I've been a VFR pilot for 16 years. I suspect I've picked up a LOT of bad habits.
Will the ADS-B transponder have it's own WAAS source? If not, you won't be ADS-B compliant since the KLN-94 isn't WAAS.
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Will the ADS-B transponder have it's own WAAS source? If not, you won't be ADS-B compliant since the KLN-94 isn't WAAS.
I'm thinking about one of the lower cost Mode S transponders, and I want one with a wifi source so I can pipe in the wx to a tablet.
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I love my 430W and would prefer a GPS approach versus ILS.
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I'm thinking about one of the lower cost Mode S transponders, and I want one with a wifi source so I can pipe in the wx to a tablet.
Do you plan to fly international?
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Do you plan to fly international?
Yes, he is. I hear a flight to CUBA is in his future! LOL! ;D
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Do you plan to fly international?
We'll see. If I fly international I have to get the 3rd class and I want to operate under basic Med. The again, I'd love to put long range tanks in the Mooney and fly to Europe. I think its only $5K to put in another 12 gallons. But without a WAAS source the Mode S is the most economical way to go, and it has the side benefit that I can use it internationally.
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We'll see. If I fly international I have to get the 3rd class and I want to operate under basic Med. The again, I'd love to put long range tanks in the Mooney and fly to Europe. I think its only $5K to put in another 12 gallons. But without a WAAS source the Mode S is the most economical way to go, and it has the side benefit that I can use it internationally.
I would hold off another year-ish. There's a lot of new technology coming out that's driving the costs down. Oshkosh should have some good stuff coming out of it so I'd wait until then at the very least before having that installed, especially if you can save some money.
I haven't made the upgrade yet but will within the next year or so.
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I have two different things driving me. First, I live right next to a Class Charlie, and two of my most common destinations are within Bravo airspace. Hence the 2020 deadline is a big deal to me. If I wait too long the avionics shops could get sufficiently booked to freeze me out of the airspace I need to go through. So I'm thinking about doing it sooner rather than later.
One the other had, as you say more parsimonious technology could lower my bill. That, and Oshkosh is but a couple months away. So we'll see. I can certainly wait that long, though I am not waiting too much longer.
That, and I have an IFR GPS to put in the panel and perhaps I'll start on the IR. The bad news is its a King, but its all I got.
Apparently I get to rejoin my Mooney on Monday!