PILOT SPIN
Spin Zone => Spin Zone => Topic started by: Mase on February 10, 2017, 12:43:08 PM
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http://www.dallasobserver.com/news/grand-prairie-woman-gets-eight-years-for-illegally-voting-in-dallas-county-elections-9173820 (http://www.dallasobserver.com/news/grand-prairie-woman-gets-eight-years-for-illegally-voting-in-dallas-county-elections-9173820)
Rosa Maria Ortega was sentenced to eight years in prison Thursday after being convicted Thursday of two counts of illegal voting. Ortega, 37, will also pay a $5,000 fine for casting ballots illegally during the 2012 general election and 2014 GOP primary runoff in Dallas County.
Ortega, according to prosecutors, successfully voted five times in elections between 2004 and 2014, despite only being an authorized resident of the United States, rather than a citizen.
Excellent.
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We've been told, over and over, that there is no proof of that happening and it simply doesn't happen.
Just ask any liberal.
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This can't be true because voter fraud doesn't exist.
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Didn't happen here either:
http://www.detroitnews.com/story/news/politics/2016/12/12/records-many-votes-detroits-precincts/95363314/
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It is RACIST to notice all the democrat vote fraud.
Don't you know that, yet?
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We've been told, over and over, that there is no proof of that happening and it simply doesn't happen.
Just ask any liberal.
That's not what we say. PS - Ms. Ortega was a registered Republican and voted for Mitt Romney.
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That's not what we say. PS - Ms. Ortega was a registered Republican and voted for Mitt Romney.
Doesn't matter in the slightest. Illegal voting is illegal voting.
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Don't know of a single person that has said no voting fraud occurs. Any system will have fraud, there just isn't a perfect system. That being said, all the evidence that exists confirms that the rate of voting fraud is so low to be barely measurable.
So.. this tread has identified 3 instances of voting fraud. Keep those examples coming until we hit the 3 million... I'll wait. ;)
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Don't know of a single person that has said no voting fraud occurs. Any system will have fraud, there just isn't a perfect system. That being said, all the evidence that exists confirms that the rate of voting fraud is so low to be barely measurable.
The people claiming no voter fraud backpedal and tap dance, claiming they meant no signficant or widespread fraud.
but you are correct that there will be some fraud as no system is perfect. However, given the profound failure to verifiy voter eligibity it's disingenuous to make claims about the rate of fraud (both people claiming no significant fraud and the people claiming millions of illegal votes).
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Doesn't matter in the slightest. Illegal voting is illegal voting.
Of course it matters, given that Number7 calls it "Democrat" vote fraud just above your post.
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Don't know of a single person that has said no voting fraud occurs. Any system will have fraud, there just isn't a perfect system. That being said, all the evidence that exists confirms that the rate of voting fraud is so low to be barely measurable.
Gary, can you point to the "evidence" in which you speak? You know 4 out of 5 dentists prefer........
:)
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Gary, can you point to the "evidence" in which you speak? You know 4 out of 5 dentists prefer........
:)
Here is some:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2014/07/09/7-papers-4-government-inquiries-2-news-investigations-and-1-court-ruling-proving-voter-fraud-is-mostly-a-myth/?utm_term=.8d832afc8316
https://www.google.com/search?%7Bgoogle:acceptedSuggestion%7Doq=studies+on+vote+fraud&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8&q=studies+on+vote+fraud
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Here is some:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2014/07/09/7-papers-4-government-inquiries-2-news-investigations-and-1-court-ruling-proving-voter-fraud-is-mostly-a-myth/?utm_term=.8d832afc8316
https://www.google.com/search?%7Bgoogle:acceptedSuggestion%7Doq=studies+on+vote+fraud&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8&q=studies+on+vote+fraud
I'm sure your internet research skills are as good as mine, there is lots out there:
http://thehill.com/homenews/house/315844-ryan-no-evidence-of-mass-voter-fraud-as-trump-claimed
http://www.brennancenter.org/analysis/debunking-voter-fraud-myth
https://www.eac.gov/assets/1/workflow_staging/Page/57.PDF
This one was interesting in that they did find non-citizens voting, a documented problem with the way we maintain our voting roles:
http://www.judicialwatch.org/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/Do-Non-Citizens-Vote-in-US-Elections-Richman-et-al.pdf
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Of course it matters, given that Number7 calls it "Democrat" vote fraud just above your post.
Did you read my post?
How could you conclude that I SAID this one particular vote fraud conviction was democrat vote fraud? Especially since I posted a general statement.
Is that you virtue signaling?
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Don't know of a single person that has said no voting fraud occurs. Any system will have fraud, there just isn't a perfect system. That being said, all the evidence that exists confirms that the rate of voting fraud is so low to be barely measurable.
So.. this tread has identified 3 instances of voting fraud. Keep those examples coming until we hit the 3 million... I'll wait. ;)
There is no evidence, it is a negative assertion. But we are prevented from proving the positive assertion by the ACLU.
I have investigated voter records in my county and found many things that I cannot explain - addresses that i cannot drive to or do not appear on the tax records, names that are not associated to home ownership, more homeless people registered than the surveys say exist and student registrations that are years past graduation (and still registered in their dorms). But I am one person and I want to have a life, not chase down three million illegal voter registrations.
Voting fraud starts with registration fraud and we simply do not have a good way to determine how much registration fraud exists. That erodes confidence in the system and is the source behind voter ID laws.
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I'm sure your internet research skills are as good as mine, there is lots out there:
http://thehill.com/homenews/house/315844-ryan-no-evidence-of-mass-voter-fraud-as-trump-claimed
http://www.brennancenter.org/analysis/debunking-voter-fraud-myth
https://www.eac.gov/assets/1/workflow_staging/Page/57.PDF
This one was interesting in that they did find non-citizens voting, a documented problem with the way we maintain our voting roles:
http://www.judicialwatch.org/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/Do-Non-Citizens-Vote-in-US-Elections-Richman-et-al.pdf
I can find many articles INDICATING voter fraud, and its ease.
New York City’s watchdog Department of Investigations has just provided the latest evidence of how easy it is to commit voter fraud that is almost undetectable. DOI undercover agents showed up at 63 polling places last fall and pretended to be voters who should have been turned away by election officials; the agents assumed the names of individuals who had died or moved out of town, or who were sitting in jail. In 61 instances, or 97 percent of the time, the testers were allowed to vote.
Read more at: http://www.nationalreview.com/article/368234/voter-fraud-weve-got-proof-its-easy-john-fund
Until there is voter ID, voter fraud will take place, especially in inner cities, and by DEMOCRATS.
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There is no evidence, it is a negative assertion. But we are prevented from proving the positive assertion by the ACLU.
I have investigated voter records in my county and found many things that I cannot explain - addresses that i cannot drive to or do not appear on the tax records, names that are not associated to home ownership, more homeless people registered than the surveys say exist and student registrations that are years past graduation (and still registered in their dorms). But I am one person and I want to have a life, not chase down three million illegal voter registrations.
Voting fraud starts with registration fraud and we simply do not have a good way to determine how much registration fraud exists. That erodes confidence in the system and is the source behind voter ID laws.
What a great reason to change the structure of our voter registration and purging system, but not so great a reason to implement voter ID. Though, personally, I'd be willing to accept voter ID with a change to an opt-out style registration system.
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By Gary's logic, the fact that Seattle only issued about 1,300 jaywalking tickets in 2011 means that only 1300 people jaywalked.
The only reason there were that many ticket is because it is a visible crime and because the police were looking. Imagine that nobody was really looking and that people jaywalking looked just like people not jaywalking. How many tickets would they have written in that case?
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What a great reason to change the structure of our voter registration and purging system, but not so great a reason to implement voter ID.
Actually, voter ID makes registration fraud very difficult to execute on. If you have to show a picture ID that matches the name you're trying to vote with then you have to have a whole library of fake ID cards. It raises the bar much higher than saying "hello, my name is Bob and I live on Elm St".
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Before the thread devolves into supposed "disenfranchisement," I submit once again our local food bank, which requires a photo ID and proof of residence of the city, in order to obtain food.
I also submit that eating is more essential than voting, and that the group using the food bank has not raised any outcry about being disenfranchised when it comes to getting free food.
When people thoughtfully consider their options, they are amazingly willing to comply with the rules. These are the people who will make thoughtful voters.
Most people desiring to receive free food from the food bank will provide the documentation required. Some will achieve fraud, but it will require more effort than honest compliance.
Fraud will never go away, but it should be made much, much more difficult than honest compliance. That said, I have no problem whatsoever with honest compliance being EFFORTFUL.
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What a great reason to change the structure of our voter registration and purging system, but not so great a reason to implement voter ID. Though, personally, I'd be willing to accept voter ID with a change to an opt-out style registration system.
I wish someone could provide an intelligent rationale as to why a voter should not have to prove who he is before casting a vote.
EVERY adult in this country has a means of identification and it is free or very low cost.
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I wish someone could provide an intelligent rationale as to why a voter should not have to prove who he is before casting a vote
There isn't one.
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By Gary's logic, the fact that Seattle only issued about 1,300 jaywalking tickets in 2011 means that only 1300 people jaywalked.
The only reason there were that many ticket is because it is a visible crime and because the police were looking. Imagine that nobody was really looking and that people jaywalking looked just like people not jaywalking. How many tickets would they have written in that case?
These are not similar. Jaywalkers don't have to register to walk across the street or leave a paper trail when they cross. Walks across the street are not public record. Walking across the street is not of fundamental importance to the functioning of our Republic.
Obviously I understand the point you're trying to make. But I disagree with the assertion that there is no in-built verification or monitoring, or ability to post-process election data to uncover whether widespread fraud is evident.