PILOT SPIN
Spin Zone => Spin Zone => Topic started by: Lucifer on September 04, 2022, 05:08:38 PM
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https://www.zerohedge.com/political/activists-more-halfway-forcing-constitutional-amendment-convention
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Bring it on!
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I would support that.
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Reasonable citizens would support this. Career politicians and career fed gov bureaucrats? Not so much.
An Article V convention would severely restrict their power and take them out of the equation. I could see both political parties and their career politician members undermining this, using lawfare and endless political moves to slow it or outright kill it.
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Problem, as I see it, there will be Democrat states represented that will muck up the works.
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It's easy to win them over to our side -- you just have to be willing to shed a little blood. Sadam Hussein did it in less than a week. ;)
I am in favor of limited terms, but not necessarily in term limits. I just think it should be self-limiting as the founders intended -- that we would have an entirely new government every 6 years. Everyone knows the story of Jefferson and Co. vs Madison and Co and that Madison eventually won out, and we now know what that has produced: a ruling class and a fourth branch of government. These two things must be eliminated, but I do want to be able to elect whomever I want to elect as much as I want to elect (I could easily go or 3-4 terms of Reagan or Trump!).
The problem as I see it, is not one of terms, but one of incumbency. I bristle at the notion of an arbitrary time limit such as 12 years. I would propose an amendment that would prohibit one seeking office, elected or appointed, while holding office, elected or appointed. Having a true citizen government where they would have to then live under the laws they created would naturally lead to balanced budgets and elimination of graft, and elimination of unnecessary bureaucracy, more ideas that are long overdue. For that matter, I can't think of a current amendment beyond the original 10 that are worth keeping.
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Got an email this morning directing me to this petition. My distrust of everything right now holds me back from signing, but my disgust at everything right now makes me want to sign.
https://cos.nucleuspages.com/landing/triumphant-state-legislative-form?utm_medium=email&utm_source=bd8aa48a5-ncl_amplify&utm_campaign=230512-0509_cos_list_rental_short_version_w_buttons_sl_2&utm_content=ncl-wx95SmVTjG&_nlid=wx95SmVTjG&_nhids=rZRJC0ex1
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Got an email this morning directing me to this petition. My distrust of everything right now holds me back from signing, but my disgust at everything right now makes me want to sign.
https://cos.nucleuspages.com/landing/triumphant-state-legislative-form?utm_medium=email&utm_source=bd8aa48a5-ncl_amplify&utm_campaign=230512-0509_cos_list_rental_short_version_w_buttons_sl_2&utm_content=ncl-wx95SmVTjG&_nlid=wx95SmVTjG&_nhids=rZRJC0ex1
Not me. Unless I know who generated that site, and what they are actually up to, I'm not giving them data.
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Not me. Unless I know who generated that site, and what they are actually up to, I'm not giving them data.
And that’s just it. Those things are almost impossible to know.
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And that’s just it. Those things are almost impossible to know.
If you want to sign the petition go directly to their website. Don’t respond to unsolicited email.
https://conventionofstates.com/
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If you want to sign the petition go directly to their website. Don’t respond to unsolicited email.
https://conventionofstates.com/
I'd like to sign, but I'm cautious for another reason.
What if we get what we ask for (CoS), but the result isn't what we desired; sort of like the last two elections.
If someone can convince me we won't lose 2A, and that the over-reach of Fed-Gov won't be maintained and extended, I'll sign in a heartbeat.
How would votes be apportioned? Would each State have equal votes, or would population enter into it?
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I'd like to sign, but I'm cautious for another reason.
What if we get what we ask for (CoS), but the result isn't what we desired; sort of like the last two elections.
If someone can convince me we won't lose 2A, and that the over-reach of Fed-Gov won't be maintained and extended, I'll sign in a heartbeat.
How would votes be apportioned? Would each State have equal votes, or would population enter into it?
I share your concern but don't know enough about it to opine how it will end up. I haven't signed it either yet but might one of these days if I learn more about it and think it's the right way to go.
My thoughts right now are coming to "what have we got to lose?" Our country is circling the drain and if we don't do something we're done. Maybe the 2024 election will be the last straw for me. The Dems HAVE to lose (unless it's RFK Jr... POSSIBLY...) but if they cheat and keep Biden, it will be game over. We have a chance as long as Trump (or MAYBE RFKJr) is elected, because the Uniparty doesn't want them and we will know they didn't succeed with the cheating. But if they succeed again, I don't see a way out.
Then it will be either convention of states or all out civil war which will be "actual insurrection" and land us all in prison (or dead) unless we win. I'm too old to go there. So I'll have to go with CoS.
But the real problem is more than just politics. It's culture. It's education. It's that our children are being indoctrinated into Marxism. It's that we face a catastrophic break in production and standard of living and literal REproduction. None of this will be fixed with just a populist president. If the conservative right tries to force cultural change, like DeSantis in Florida in some ways (abortion bans in a state are one thing, if he tries to do it nationally that's a whole different thing), I'm not for right wing authoritarianism any more than left wing authoritarianism. Only to the extent that the right wing version can at least keep our oil flowing and our economy going.
What we really need is de-centralization. Bring the power back to local communities. Then you can have your ultra conservative locales and your liberal shitholes. What is concerning is centralized authoritarianism of either stripe, trying to tell the entire country how to live.
And that still leaves the literal millions of Federal employees in the agencies, speaking of telling us all how to live, that need to be dismantled. ONLY TRUMP has made any headway in that direction with his rolling back two or more regulations for every one enacted, and even that was way, way below what is needed.
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I share your concern but don't know enough about it to opine how it will end up. I haven't signed it either yet but might one of these days if I learn more about it and think it's the right way to go.
My thoughts right now are coming to "what have we got to lose?" Our country is circling the drain and if we don't do something we're done. Maybe the 2024 election will be the last straw for me. The Dems HAVE to lose (unless it's RFK Jr... POSSIBLY...) but if they cheat and keep Biden, it will be game over. We have a chance as long as Trump (or MAYBE RFKJr) is elected, because the Uniparty doesn't want them and we will know they didn't succeed with the cheating. But if they succeed again, I don't see a way out.
Then it will be either convention of states or all out civil war which will be "actual insurrection" and land us all in prison (or dead) unless we win. I'm too old to go there. So I'll have to go with CoS.
But the real problem is more than just politics. It's culture. It's education. It's that our children are being indoctrinated into Marxism. It's that we face a catastrophic break in production and standard of living and literal REproduction. None of this will be fixed with just a populist president. If the conservative right tries to force cultural change, like DeSantis in Florida in some ways (abortion bans in a state are one thing, if he tries to do it nationally that's a whole different thing), I'm not for right wing authoritarianism any more than left wing authoritarianism. Only to the extent that the right wing version can at least keep our oil flowing and our economy going.
What we really need is de-centralization. Bring the power back to local communities. Then you can have your ultra conservative locales and your liberal shitholes. What is concerning is centralized authoritarianism of either stripe, trying to tell the entire country how to live.
And that still leaves the literal millions of Federal employees in the agencies, speaking of telling us all how to live, that need to be dismantled. ONLY TRUMP has made any headway in that direction with his rolling back two or more regulations for every one enacted, and even that was way, way below what is needed.
The presidency is a small part of the problem. The HUGE part of this problem is congress. Both the congress and the senate are fuckin' pathetic. If we truly want change, we must cut the head off of the snake, and that's congress.
It would be super easy to primary and run these bastards out of town (both R and D) if we didn't have such voter apathy. Wyoming just did it by getting rid of Miss Piggy. That's the example.
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Yes, but that's counting on a congressman doing what he promised to do, and we all know how that works out.
Washington will not fix itself. We need a civil war and need to exterminate the vermin.
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Yes, but that's counting on a congressman doing what he promised to do, and we all know how that works out.
Washington will not fix itself. We need a civil war and need to exterminate the vermin.
The Federal Government has demonstrated it will not allow secession of States from the union. That criminal Lincoln proved that and our government was much less powerful then and looked what they did to the South.
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The Federal Government has demonstrated it will not allow secession of States from the union.
Generally, nations don't allow it. That's why you have to fight and win.
This isn't really new territory that we're in.
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The presidency is a small part of the problem. The HUGE part of this problem is congress. Both the congress and the senate are fuckin' pathetic. If we truly want change, we must cut the head off of the snake, and that's congress.
It would be super easy to primary and run these bastards out of town (both R and D) if we didn't have such voter apathy. Wyoming just did it by getting rid of Miss Piggy. That's the example.
Gonna disagree, to an extent. Yes, Congress is a problem in the fact that they have written bills that allow the Secretary of whatever department to set limits, etc rather than doing that themselves effectively putting unelected bureaucrats in charge of the Government.
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Generally, nations don't allow it. That's why you have to fight and win.
This isn't really new territory that we're in.
It's sad we're at this point.......again. We need a Constitutional Amendment to enable secession.
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Gonna disagree, to an extent. Yes, Congress is a problem in the fact that they have written bills that allow the Secretary of whatever department to set limits, etc rather than doing that themselves effectively putting unelected bureaucrats in charge of the Government.
Our founding fathers set up 3 equal branches of government with checks and balances. The legislative, house of representatives control the budget. The President (Executive) could say "I'm sending $10 billion to Ukraine", but unless congress appropriates the money, he can't. He can't over ride them.
Because of congress, not the executive, we don't have a balanced budget. Our congressmen don't even read the bills their staffers write. Our congress give away our tax dollars, and borrow money for pet projects.
And where we are today, the legislative branch has oversight over the executive. We have a president who is on the verge of treason by taking bribes (among other crimes), yet our congress does nothing.
Our president has weaponized his agencies under the executive, and our congress, who have oversight and control agency funding, do nothing.
Congress just recently sold us down the river (again) by passing the debt ceiling bill.
Change the president, but unless we get rid of this congress, don't expect much change.
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Yes, but that's counting on a congressman doing what he promised to do, and we all know how that works out.
Washington will not fix itself. We need a civil war and need to exterminate the vermin.
That’s why an Article V COS is literally the only way to take things out of the slimy mitts of Congress.
Only the States have the power under Article V. FedGov is blocked from the process.
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I'd like to sign, but I'm cautious for another reason.
What if we get what we ask for (CoS), but the result isn't what we desired; sort of like the last two elections.
If someone can convince me we won't lose 2A, and that the over-reach of Fed-Gov won't be maintained and extended, I'll sign in a heartbeat.
How would votes be apportioned? Would each State have equal votes, or would population enter into it?
I don't see how that is worse than the fucking scum bag democrats shredding the constitution without input.
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That’s why an Article V COS is literally the only way to take things out of the slimy mitts of Congress.
Only the States have the power under Article V. FedGov is blocked from the process.
We need to do this and if the attempts fail then you know the rest.
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I don't see how that is worse than the fucking scum bag democrats shredding the constitution without input.
We need to do this and if the attempts fail then you know the rest.
I think you are both right. We might not get what we want out of a COS, but we sure as shit aren't getting what we want now.
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I think you are both right. We might not get what we want out of a COS, but we sure as shit aren't getting what we want now.
Agree with all three of you.
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(https://i.imgur.com/YwHk8mz.png)
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(https://i.imgur.com/3BzOvMK.jpg)