PILOT SPIN
Spin Zone => Spin Zone => Topic started by: bflynn on December 01, 2017, 08:13:09 AM
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This is what he has? Millions of dollars to investigate whether or not the Trump team worked with Russia to win the election and what he comes up with is a single charge of making a wrong statement? Seriously? That's like my stock broker selling me on the idea that he take turn 20% on my 10k investment and then returning 10 cents profit.
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2017/12/01/michael-flynn-charged-in-russia-investigation-guilty-plea-expected.html
The "most powerful man in Washington" gets to say "you lied. Once."
BTW, no relation that I know of.
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Yep. The multi million dollar circus known as the Mueller Special Investigation has turned up another item that could have easily been done with traditional law enforcement. And once again doesn't show any evidence that there was collusion by the Trump campaign.
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The Watergate investigation started with 4 small time hoods pleading to a misdemeanor B&E. Flynn was the US National Security Advisor, and he's been turned for leniency. Along with the lying to FBI, should be a whole gamut of other felonies like obstruction of justice, purjury, conspiracy to commit something, and his admitted failure to register as a foreign agent. If they are tossing all those other underlying charges, they are expecting him to sing, and take down the chief.
We will see. Erlichman and Haldeman got the whole felony code book tossed at them for basically the same thing.
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Ken Starr spent 5 years investigating the Clintons and couldn't come up with anything better than a stained dress.
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Ken Starr spent 5 years investigating the Clintons and couldn't come up with anything better than a stained dress.
Perjury by a lawyer in a court of law means nothing to you, huh? I guess it just depends on which jersey he is wearing for you.
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Ken Starr spent 5 years investigating the Clintons and couldn't come up with anything better than a stained dress.
Actually, he did but didn't out it all. I know a lady who was involved with that investigation and she said the decision was made not to press it. But there was plenty of evidence of him having committed crimes, including perjury, lying and obstruction. But given the political environment at the time, there was zero chance of him being removed from office, so it would have just prolonged the circus.
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It looks like this is the reason for the plea deal:
https://twitter.com/joyindc/status/936626652284620800
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David French has a good take:
https://twitter.com/DavidAFrench/status/936637735917572096
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Both statements referred to in the indictment were in late Dec 2016. Almost two months after the election, and only about a month before he was fired. This ties in with his false statement to Pence about his dealings with the Russians. If they have something on him from fall 2016, Katy bar the door. But so far, this is small doings, and his conduct all during transition is normal statecraft that any incoming elec would be involved in. The media is salivating.
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So everyone (MSM, libs and other Trump haters) is ready and willing to believe anything Flynn (a proven liar) says to save his ass.
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Rats will do what rats do. Watergate was the primer. It's not the meeting that was the problem, it was the coverup of the meeting that got him in the end. As long as you tell the FBI the truth, or tell them to go pound sand, you have no problem.
This is a good time to remind everyone - NEVER 'talk' to LEO. You are not discussing ball scores, and the heat wave. Anything and everything you say to LEO is fair game. i.e. - 'Hey Mike, did you talk to that Kislyk guy from Russia recently?'. 'Well, Tom, since you are a law enforcement officer, and you are asking me a question all I can say is please take this circular pastry, roll it down the street, and attempt fornication. Have a nice day!'
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It looks like this is the reason for the plea deal:
https://twitter.com/joyindc/status/936626652284620800
I doubt it. If you read or heard his statement then you know that he denies treason, which selling out the United States would have been. Remember that the man is a career warrior and has been on one post or another in service of the country for 3 decades.
I am sure that the President told him to talk to someone in Russia. That is what a national security in a transition should do. He also probably talked to people in the UK, France and Israel just to start naming a list.
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Maybe Flynn will pull a Frankie "Five angels" at the Senate hearing.
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I doubt it. If you read or heard his statement then you know that he denies treason, which selling out the United States would have been. Remember that the man is a career warrior and has been on one post or another in service of the country for 3 decades.
I am sure that the President told him to talk to someone in Russia. That is what a national security in a transition should do. He also probably talked to people in the UK, France and Israel just to start naming a list.
Who said anything about treason (other than Flynn in his statement)? What I posted after that from David French provides some better insight.
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After ABC news broke the story yesterday about Flynn being directed to make contact with the Russians, they had to issue a major correction since that direction to make contact was during the transition and is not at all uncommon:
https://twitter.com/ABC/status/936805557029048321
Their initial report caused the stock market to dip for a period of time because they said Flynn was directed to make contact during the campaign.
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When ABC made that initial report, the DOW plunged around 300 points. Prior to that, it was surging due to the likelihood of the Senate tax package passing. But then dark clouds began drifting over the Senate tax plan.
After the market closed, ABC made their correction and the Senate voted to approve the tax plan with only one R and 48 Ds voting no.
I'm curious about what will happen on Monday. What other dirt will the MSM make up to help trash and divide the country.
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Great article in National Review about the entire investigation:
While all that plays out, though, behold the frightening thing Mueller’s investigation has become: a criminalization of politics. In the new order of things, policy differences are the grist for investigation and prosecution.
http://www.nationalreview.com/article/454293/robert-mueller-trump-russia-investigation-michael-flynn-obama-administration-foreign-policy-israel
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The Mueller investigation is about nothing but politics. It's retribution by a political party that suffered one of the most spectacular defeats in history.
After millions of tax dollars spent, a congressional investigation, a senate investigation and Muellers investigation there has yet to be one piece of evidence that shows any collusion between the Trump campaign and the Russians. And all of this while ignoring the real collusion story which involved the Clintons, Uranium One, Mueller and Comey as well as Obama.
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Flynn admits to lying to the FBI, but we should believe what he says now?
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Flynn admits to lying to the FBI, but we should believe what he says now?
He was facing 60 years in prison. By "confessing" to his lies, and potentially making Trump look bad, he got that down to a few months.
I would have done the same thing. "Yes, my deceased Mother and Father were traitorous criminals. Now, can I get out of prison for saying that?"
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He was facing 60 years in prison. By "confessing" to his lies, and potentially making Trump look bad, he got that down to a few months.
I would have done the same thing. "Yes, my deceased Mother and Father were traitorous criminals. Now, can I get out of prison for saying that?"
Never talk to the Federales.
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This is interesting:
https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/937007006526959618
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Actually, he did but didn't out it all. I know a lady who was involved with that investigation and she said the decision was made not to press it. But there was plenty of evidence of him having committed crimes, including perjury, lying and obstruction. But given the political environment at the time, there was zero chance of him being removed from office, so it would have just prolonged the circus.
Do tell!!! My second cousin knows that her hairdresser has a client that says Bill Clinton was completely innocent! (said in pure jest).
But beside the fact President Clinton was elected (twice) means that the voters knew and didn't care. At least I've heard similar logic from the current President. That being said, I'd rate President Clinton somewhere below pond scum. Was a talented politician however.
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Ken Starr spent 5 years investigating the Clintons and couldn't come up with anything better than a stained dress.
Any idea of what we spent on the Bengazi hearings, all 20 or 30 of them?
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This is interesting:
https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/937007006526959618
Had to read that three times, still not sure what the President means.
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Do tell!!! My second cousin knows that her hairdresser has a client that says Bill Clinton was completely innocent! (said in pure jest).
But beside the fact President Clinton was elected (twice) means that the voters knew and didn't care. At least I've heard similar logic from the current President. That being said, I'd rate President Clinton somewhere below pond scum. Was a talented politician however.
Ok...but her name is Tracy, she lives in Baltimore. This isn't my friend's uncle's cousin. She has a great story about standing in Ken Starr's face and them screaming at each other. Apparently spittle was involved.
The point was that there was plenty that he did and it was known. But the political reality was that nothing was going to come of it, just like today. Trump has only a slightly larger chance of being removed from office than Clinton did because he simply will never be impeached. Perhaps in 2023, IF Democrats gain control of a lot of the state legislatures and can redraw district lines so they are favored in the House. But until then, there is practically nothing that Trump could do which would convince 24 Republicans to abandon the party and give Democrats so much more power. They simply desire their jobs too much and any Republican who voted to impeach Trump would find themselves on the outside of the Party.
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Had to read that three times, still not sure what the President means.
You need the translator? Trump is saying "Flynn did nothing illegal and I didn't break the law either, so don't try to pin something on me."
In the scope of the investigation into collusion between the candidate and Trump, this is only slightly more serious than someone not washing their hands after using the restroom.
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You need the translator? Trump is saying "Flynn did nothing illegal and I didn't break the law either, so don't try to pin something on me."
In the scope of the investigation into collusion between the candidate and Trump, this is only slightly more serious than someone not washing their hands after using the restroom.
Is the President saying he knew Flynn lied to the FBI? Is that why he fired him?
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You need the translator? Trump is saying "Flynn did nothing illegal and I didn't break the law either, so don't try to pin something on me."
In the scope of the investigation into collusion between the candidate and Trump, this is only slightly more serious than someone not washing their hands after using the restroom.
It appears he's saying that because Flynn lied to the Vice President and the FBI, Trump had to fire him.
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ABC News has suspended Brian Ross for his faulty report on Flynn:
https://twitter.com/CBSNews/status/937094032605491200
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How much part did Brian Ross's bogus report play in the DOW dropping 300 points at one point?
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How much part did Brian Ross's bogus report play in the DOW dropping 300 points at one point?
Don't know for sure, but that was about the same time I started reading the Rs were running into some snags on Tax reform and the vote was not assured. I think it was the combination punch that caused the big drop.
I'm waiting to see how Monday goes since both of those obstacles have been removed.
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How much part did Brian Ross's bogus report play in the DOW dropping 300 points at one point?
I'd argue that it was the biggest factor in it dropping. The way his report read was that it was candidate Trump, not President-elect Trump, that had ordered some sort of contact with the Russians. This caused the investors to panic thinking the worst, that we were looking at potential impeachment proceedings and a possible resignation/removal of a president from office. At least that's based on some of the reports I've read.
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How many people benefitted from the lies of disney’s News network?
Who were those people who won off the drop in stock prices and how closely are they associated with the deep state, or Soros?
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I'd argue that it was the biggest factor in it dropping. The way his report read was that it was candidate Trump, not President-elect Trump, that had ordered some sort of contact with the Russians. This caused the investors to panic thinking the worst, that we were looking at potential impeachment proceedings and a possible resignation/removal of a president from office. At least that's based on some of the reports I've read.
I read those same comments; on the ...NBC channels and other Trump hating channels and websites ecstatically proclaiming the end of Trump. I still think it was the one-two punch that did it.
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Markets HATE instability, and anything like Presidential controversy can cause instability, especially if it torpedoed the corporate, and personal tax cuts. The markets have already built in the economic stimulus this will cause. I am not sure the Brian Ross lie was financially motivated by those who short stocks, and make a killing, but it could have been. Who knows. Wide swings happen because of the algorithmic trading now going on especially by institutional investors.
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https://www.wsj.com/articles/muellers-credibility-problem-1512432318
ll of this reinforces our doubts about Mr. Mueller’s ability to conduct a fair and credible probe of the FBI’s considerable part in the Russia-Trump drama. Mr. Mueller ran the bureau for 12 years and is fast friends with Mr. Comey, whose firing by Mr. Trump triggered his appointment as special counsel. The reluctance to cooperate with a congressional inquiry compounds doubts related to this clear conflict of interest
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News that the FBI investigator fired from the Mueller investigation is the guy who changed the FBI statement on Clinton's email investigation from "grossly negligent" to "extremely careless".
http://www.cnn.com/2017/12/04/politics/peter-strzok-james-comey/index.html
Why does this matter? Because the wording of the statute covering exposure of classified info uses the term 'gross negligence' as the definition for the failure to protect and care for state secrets. He's also highly partisan, and has been caught all over the Clinton campaign.
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There's more talk of obstruction of justice with the firing of Comey, and Trump knowing that he lied to Pence, and possibly the FBI. Nevermind obstruction - I have been wondering about misprision of felony. If Trump became aware of Flynn lying to Pence and the FBI and not only did he not report it to authorities, he actually asked Comey to go easy on Flynn for personal reasons. I'm no lawyer, but Trump had to know that lying to the FBI is against the law.
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There's more talk of obstruction of justice with the firing of Comey, and Trump knowing that he lied to Pence, and possibly the FBI. Nevermind obstruction - I have been wondering about misprision of felony. If Trump became aware of Flynn lying to Pence and the FBI and not only did he not report it to authorities, he actually asked Comey to go easy on Flynn for personal reasons. I'm no lawyer, but Trump had to know that lying to the FBI is against the law.
What's going on right now is they are trying to find a crime to fit the evidence, and it's not working.
But more important we are witnessing a coup d'état right before our eyes. This is a coup of the progressives aided by the establishment to bring down a rightful elected President and his administration.
When one goes back and looks at the timeline of events, and more importantly the players it becomes very obvious the motives in this fiasco. If there was an actual "Russia Collusion" investigation happening the evidence is there and it involves Clinton, Mueller, Comey and Rosenstein. But this Special Counsel has nothing to do with Russian Collusion, that was just the excuse Comey used to get his pal Mueller, appointed by their pal Rosenstein (which all 3 are closely tied to the Clintons) to open an investigation which the eventual goal is to bring down the President with a fraudulent impeachment.
Ask yourself this: If the progressives are successful in getting Trump removed does it stop there? The answer is "of course not", they will not stand for a President Pence so he will have to go as well. How about Trump's actions in office? The progressives will declare, and find a way to nullify each and every one because he was illegitimate in their eyes.
The progressives had convinced themselves after the first election of the Alt Left Progressive Obama that they had finally achieved their dream of a march towards a totalitarian government in the country. When he was reelected that just strengthened their belief and they bought into the propaganda that Hillary had already won the election the day she announced. The election of 2016 sent shock waves through the progressives which they feel the election was "stolen" from them, and now they are seeing eight years of Trump will unravel everything they have worked for.
Finally, I'm convinced at the end of the day those who still feel our constitution matters and is the law of the land will prevail and this whole matter will come to an end. But the progressives will use it for their battle cry at every election.
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There's more talk of obstruction of justice with the firing of Comey, and Trump knowing that he lied to Pence, and possibly the FBI. Nevermind obstruction - I have been wondering about misprision of felony. If Trump became aware of Flynn lying to Pence and the FBI and not only did he not report it to authorities, he actually asked Comey to go easy on Flynn for personal reasons. I'm no lawyer, but Trump had to know that lying to the FBI is against the law.
That’s one way to spin it.
I read something that sounds completely different.
I read that the FBI told Trump that Flynn told them the same lie he told Pence, so Trump had to fire him.
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That’s one way to spin it.
I read something that sounds completely different.
I read that the FBI told Trump that Flynn told them the same lie he told Pence, so Trump had to fire him.
That would account for the 'what did he know, and when did he know it' issue. And would take misprision off the table. The MSM is trying to insinuate again that by the tweets coming from Trump(or his lawyer maybe) that he knew Flynn lied in advance of firing him.
It certainly is looking like the anal probe is being rammed as deep as possible in this admin. They will hunt for the smallest of cracks in the politics and try to make something stick.
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There's more talk of obstruction of justice with the firing of Comey, and Trump knowing that he lied to Pence, and possibly the FBI. Nevermind obstruction - I have been wondering about misprision of felony. If Trump became aware of Flynn lying to Pence and the FBI and not only did he not report it to authorities, he actually asked Comey to go easy on Flynn for personal reasons. I'm no lawyer, but Trump had to know that lying to the FBI is against the law.
You know Brian Ross?
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I'm no lawyer, but Trump had to know that lying to the FBI is against the law.
If Trump knew that someone lied to the FBI is it illegal to not report it? Does that go for everyone or just for Trump? I haven't been able to find that anywhere.
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At some point the light has to shine on Mueller and his conflicts of interest.
He needs to be investigated for official misconduct, as well as action taken be the BAR to take away his law license.
You can't knowingly continue with conflicts of interest, and he is sure conflicted.
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If Trump knew that someone lied to the FBI is it illegal to not report it? Does that go for everyone or just for Trump? I haven't been able to find that anywhere.
Well, technically it goes for everyone. The statute is misprision of felony. However, it's rarely used in a case of knowledge of a potential crime after the fact. It has been used successfully against a person who had foreknowledge of a crime and failed to report it to LEO.
Example: You get a text misdirected from someone you don't know that says; 'we will be hitting the First Bank of Denver with guns loaded, and take all their money at 9 am on Wed Dec 6'. At any time before wed dec 6 9 am, you are supposed to alert the LEO, even if you don't find the text credible. Failure is misprision.
Example 2: You are sitting in a bar, and the drunk next to you says; 'I tossed that bitch over, smacked her hard a couple times, then rammed it where the sun don't shine'. In this case, it would be after the alleged assault, not enough information, and hardly credible from the mouth of a drunk in a bar, clearly rambling. You have no DUTY to tell LEO, but you may want to tell them. In this case, no misprision applies.
Recent example 3; Continuing felony - would be the United passenger that overheard an asian woman concerned about her passport entering the US and the busybody thought there may be human trafficking involved. She told the crew, who told LEO, and they detained this asian woman for a while investigating possible human trafficking. The busybody was correct in the application of her concerns, and could not later face misprision if indeed it were a case of trafficking, and she failed to report it.
Defense to misprision; 'I did not find the statement(s) credible'. 'I don't know what you're talking about'. My favorite: 'Am I free to go?' If not, 'lawyer'.
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On the other hand, in order to prove misprision, you have to prove (1) that someone else committed a felony; (2) that the defendant had full knowledge of that fact; (3) that he or she failed to notify the authorities; and (4) that he or she took affirmative steps to conceal the crime. As a legal idea, misprision in the US legal system is virtually impossible to prove.
Turning specifically to the president, the fact, that the president fired Flynn for lying, said he fired him for lying at the time and then recently tweeted a reminder that he knew he was lying when he fired him pretty much blows the 4th criteria away. There's absolutely no way to show that he took an affirmative step to conceal the crime.
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Thank you! I appreciate the explanation.
But another twist. Trump is the chief law enforcement officer. The FBI's boss. He has to tell his underlings? Technically the FBI knew since their boss knew.
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Mueller KNEW at least one of his team was acting outside the law and tried to hide it. Because that pig was working for the 'right' side, he chose to put the entire office at risk and potentially be indicted and disbarred.
That's what really matters.
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Thank you! I appreciate the explanation.
But another twist. Trump is the chief law enforcement officer. The FBI's boss. He has to tell his underlings? Technically the FBI knew since their boss knew.
Trump can be charged with obstruction, but he can't be charged for obstruction for firing Comey, since that's his Constitutional right.
Trump's personal lawyer, John Dowd, has said that it was him that crafted the tweet that got sent out on Trump's twitter account reference knowing about Flynn's lying to the FBI as a reason for his dismissal.
http://edition.cnn.com/2017/12/03/politics/flynn-firing-dowd-tweet/index.html
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Mueller KNEW at least one of his team was acting outside the law and tried to hide it. Because that pig was working for the 'right' side, he chose to put the entire office at risk and potentially be indicted and disbarred.
That's what really matters.
There's a lot that matters. It's not as simple as you would like it to be. Trump isn't helping himself right now. Neither is his team, apparently, by sending out tweets like the one from this weekend.
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This is where there is very murky legal ground, and it's time to admit - I am not a lawyer, and I did not stay in a Holiday inn last night.
Misprision was used recently, but I can't recall the case. One of the shootings or something, and I'm not going to look it up. It is hard to prove, which is likely why it's not on the table for Trump.
Further, there's the swampy legal case where the president can't be tried in a court, but must go through the intra-political process of impeachment. IE, he is 'tried' by the second branch of govt, with the third branch overseeing the process for legality, and process control. Nixon was not indicted for Watergate, but don't forget he was listed on the indictment of Haldeman and Erlichman as an 'un-indicted co-conspirator'. Which in laymans terms means they had him dead to rights for conspiracy, but they couldn't indict him due to him being the head of the govt which controls the levers of law enforcement. But - had he made a game of it, the indictment from his subordinates would have made devastating evidence at the impeachment hearings and trial. Further, this was also why Ford pardoned Nixon after he took office because once removed from office by resignation, and not going through the impeachment, Nixon became fair game for criminal process, even though the acts where committed while president. All this leads to many gray areas of procedure which may play out if there is some truly damning evidence that comes out of Mueller investigation. And by truly damning I don't mean testimony from a now-disgraced, previously fired, admitted liar, who is motivated to protect his skin and the skin of his relatives. That testimony(sans evidence) will never be credible.
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What is Sessions doing these days? Where are the Hillary indictments? This stuff is all clearly illegal.
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Politicians routinely lie. Extemporaneous statements that aren’t made under oath or some contractual obligation are rarely legally actionable.
On a more pragmatic note do I think that the Republicans would impeach Trump given what has been currently found? Hell no.
I’m more worried about how the tension over North Korea may play out.
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http://www.nationalreview.com/article/454361/peter-strzok-fbi-scandal-partisan-american-bureaucracy
If the story hadn’t been verified by virtually every mainstream-media outlet in the country, you’d think it came straight from conspiratorial fever dreams of the alt-right. Yesterday, news broke that Robert Mueller had months ago asked a senior FBI agent to step down from his role investigating the Trump administration. This prince of a man was caught in an extramarital affair with an FBI lawyer. The affair itself was problematic, but so was the fact that the two were found to have exchanged anti-Trump, pro-Hillary Clinton text messages.[/size]
This really needs to be shut down. I am not understanding why Trump is just standing by, seemingly, doing nothing while the deep state carries forward with this coup.
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Disagree on stopping it. If Trump didn't do anything impeachable, let them dig. We want to drain the swamp, well getting rid of an admitted liar, even if he's in the conservative side - he's part of the swamp. Manafort as well. I really don't care where the shit splatters, let them all be cleaned out - both sides.
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http://www.nationalreview.com/article/454361/peter-strzok-fbi-scandal-partisan-american-bureaucracy
This really needs to be shut down. I am not understanding why Trump is just standing by, seemingly, doing nothing while the deep state carries forward with this coup.
Trump is in the exact situation the establishment and the progressives want him in. If he attempts to shut it down then the battle cry is he is guilty! Also the mouth foaming progressives will start this "obstruction of justice" crap.
His AG Sessions conveniently recused himself and left Rosenstein in charge. Rosenstein is tied to Mueller and Comey. Ryan and McConnell are in the back room just hoping and wishing something will come of this so they can get one of their own in the Oval Office.
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Disagree on stopping it. If Trump didn't do anything impeachable, let them dig. We want to drain the swamp, well getting rid of an admitted liar, even if he's in the conservative side - he's part of the swamp. Manafort as well. I really don't care where the shit splatters, let them all be cleaned out - both sides.
I disagree. I’m for draining the swamp. But this is a partisan political witch hunt to overturn the results of an election.
To borrow a term, a ham sandwich can be impeached. Democrat members of the House are saying that a high crime and misdemeanor is whatever they say it is. Consequently, it is impossible in this political environment to say Trump didn’t do anything impeachable. You can say, and I believe, that he has done nothing illegal, but that is not the standard for impeachment.
In looking at the partisan team that Mueller has put together, including Clinton sycophants, I believe even more so in what I stated in the first paragraph.
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Ryan and McConnell are in the back room just hoping and wishing something will come of this so they can get one of their own in the Oval Office.
Hmmm... who's third in line?
BTW, I don''t know why Trump holds Sessions in such high esteem. Is it a case of keeping the enemy closer?
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Hmmm... who's third in line?
BTW, I don''t know why Trump holds Sessions in such high esteem. Is it a case of keeping the enemy closer?
Sessions only befriended Trump in order to get a cabinet position. Sessions is just another swamp dweller, he just decided a different method to get what he wants.
And make no mistake, if they were successful in getting Trump out Pence would quickly follow (out).
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Everyone needs to relax and take a breath, I suspect that it could be Trump has everyone else right where he wants them.
People continue to misunderestimate him, just like they did with W, to their own detriment and to the de-facto betterment of our nation.
He is getting a lot of stuff done, and just because the Left continues to have Republican-du-jour derangement syndrome doesn't mean they can do anything to actually stop him, the best they have managed is to slow him down.
Think how many of the Congresscritters have announced they will not seek re-election, how many newsfolk are now former newsfolk, how low the trust in media, and how despised the spineless establishment R's and RINO's are now seen to be?
This is in many ways everything many of us have wanted, for a very long time - is it messy and uncomfortable, you bet. People in power seldom give it up freely. If this is the price we pay to reign in the ruling class then so be it - Trump is strong enough and determined enough to carry through no matter.
'Gimp
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I disagree. I’m for draining the swamp. But this is a partisan political witch hunt to overturn the results of an election.
To borrow a term, a ham sandwich can be impeached. Democrat members of the House are saying that a high crime and misdemeanor is whatever they say it is. Consequently, it is impossible in this political environment to say Trump didn’t do anything impeachable. You can say, and I believe, that he has done nothing illegal, but that is not the standard for impeachment.
In looking at the partisan team that Mueller has put together, including Clinton sycophants, I believe even more so in what I stated in the first paragraph.
It's all politics. Let them hunt. If they come up with what they think is an impeachable offense that they can recommend to congress - so be it. congress will take a 5 min look at the 'evidence' presented and tell the world they are full of shit, that Mueller is on a witch hunt and has been since he hired his all left wing henchmen. I suspect that Mueller is going to draw this out until the 2018 elections, and have some kind of 'statement' in fall of 2018 to do as much damage as possible without actually having something to get.
So far, he's on the tail of 2 fairly big players, and betting he'll get pleas on those, and he's already got two scalps on his belt. This is the kind of stuff I'm fine with. Trump is learning good lessons. 1) Don't listen to your wife when she asks you to do a pol favor for someone, and 2) If you want a friend in DC, get a dog.
Mueller is putting the fear of god into sleazy pols, and the ones who aren't sleazy have no down side. We went down this road with Comey and there was no 'there, there'. His big reveal was that he leaked to the press, and it made Trump's firing look legit. Spin can only do so much, eventually the truth will out, and if it takes an ass reaming by the special investigator to get there, let's dance.
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It's all politics. Let them hunt.
The problem with "Let them hunt" is that people think that being charged or accused is the same as being guilty.
Witness those that point out that 16 women charge Trump with sexual assault. Never mind that most of that was from the made up "Russian Dossier". It may have never happened, but he was charged, so even some pilots hold him guilty sans facts.
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If trump gets impeached and removed from office, BFD. I think the Dems should be more afraid of Mike Pence because he comes across as both strong and reasonable and he destroys anyone the DNC has on tap right now.
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If trump gets impeached and removed from office, BFD. I think the Dems should be more afraid of Mike Pence because he comes across as both strong and reasonable and he destroys anyone the DNC has on tap right now.
I don't think so. The press will say he's Trump's "handpicked" successor and therefore tainted.
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If trump gets impeached and removed from office, BFD. I think the Dems should be more afraid of Mike Pence because he comes across as both strong and reasonable and he destroys anyone the DNC has on tap right now.
In that scenario if the progressives successfully got a sitting president of the other party removed, what makes you think they would stop there? Their grievance is that they lost an election they felt was rightfully theirs. They are also alarmed at how Trump has been systematically unraveling the "legacy" of their beloved BHO. Also they are alarmed they don't control the Supreme Court and that Trump has been changing the face of the judiciary in the lower courts.
And Pence would continue in that direction.
The progressives as well as the establishment are in a fight for power. Until they get an establishment type back in the WH they will not rest.
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I don't think so. The press will say he's Trump's "handpicked" successor and therefore tainted.
I disagree. I don't think they could work up anywhere near the animosity toward Pence that they were able to work up against Trump.
But I don't think it will come to that.
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http://www.nationalreview.com/article/454361/peter-strzok-fbi-scandal-partisan-american-bureaucracy
This really needs to be shut down. I am not understanding why Trump is just standing by, seemingly, doing nothing while the deep state carries forward with this coup.
So far, the only thing that's been "revealed" in this collusion investigation is that there was no collusion. The goal posts seem to keep moving from collusion to other issues. There may come a time when Trump is right to fire the special counsel, but I don't think that's now. If he did it now, they would just claim that Trump is trying to prevent evidence from being found.
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Everyone needs to relax and take a breath, I suspect that it could be Trump has everyone else right where he wants them.
Trump is not playing some big, ultra-deep chess game.
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Trump is not playing some big, ultra-deep chess game.
It's good to be da king!
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In that scenario if the progressives successfully got a sitting president of the other party removed, what makes you think they would stop there? Their grievance is that they lost an election they felt was rightfully theirs. They are also alarmed at how Trump has been systematically unraveling the "legacy" of their beloved BHO. Also they are alarmed they don't control the Supreme Court and that Trump has been changing the face of the judiciary in the lower courts.
And Pence would continue in that direction.
The progressives as well as the establishment are in a fight for power. Until they get an establishment type back in the WH they will not rest.
Trump is not getting removed from office. Even if the House changed control in 2018, the likelihood of the Senate reaching the necessary threshold for removal (2/3rds) is a far stretch after the 2018 mid terms. When Trump leaves office it'll be because he either lost in 2020, decided not to run, or was term limited in 2024.
The Republicans are not going to vote to impeach or remove Trump, including the establishment.
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Trump is not getting removed from office. Even if the House changed control in 2018, the likelihood of the Senate reaching the necessary threshold for removal (2/3rds) is a far stretch after the 2018 mid terms. When Trump leaves office it'll be because he either lost in 2020, decided not to run, or was term limited in 2024.
The Republicans are not going to vote to impeach or remove Trump, including the establishment.
Keyrekt.
However, he may leave office by dying. That's pretty permanent. I was looking at some before and after pictures of US presidents, and it's clear that the job takes a toll. I'm surprised more presidents haven't died in office from stress and overwork.