PILOT SPIN
Spin Zone => Spin Zone => Topic started by: Becky (My pronouns are Assigned/By/God) on January 19, 2019, 08:25:48 AM
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I’d wager he’ll declare an EO to secure the border.
https://mobile.twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1086395559504764930
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If he does an EO, then there are some west coast AG’s ready to file injunctions with the ninth circus. It will take a couple of months to get worked out through the courts.
Also hearing talk he’s going to propose some action on DACA in exchange for funds. This would be a good deal as he publically makes an offer to help them, only to have the dims refuse, and show their constituents how they really don’t care about them, well, except for their votes.
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Also hearing talk he’s going to propose some action on DACA in exchange for funds. This would be a good deal as he publically makes an offer to help them, only to have the dims refuse, and show their constituents how they really don’t care about them, well, except for their votes.
That's what I'm thinking.
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I’m just hoping someone reports from the border showing ought but blue sky, tumbleweeds and the occasional lizard.
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I’m just hoping someone reports from the border showing ought but blue sky, tumbleweeds and the occasional lizard.
Jim Acosta did that, with that result as he was standing in front of a border barrier.
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Moved to 4pm eastern.
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I’m just hoping someone reports from the border showing ought but blue sky, tumbleweeds and the occasional lizard.
So how did the 40 Million ILLEGAL ALIENS get here? Do you really want to keep spending the billions of dollars they are costing the American taxpayer each year to stroke your ego into thinking you really must like Brown people? Also, are OK with the security risks and unsecured border pose to American citizens. Do you really NOT want to know who is coming here?
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So it looks like the dims will backstab DACA once again.
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-01-19/trump-promises-announcement-on-border-as-talks-remain-stalled
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It's very conceivable that McConnell can get this through the senate with 60 votes.
If presented to the house, it's conceivable that several moderate dims will break with Pelosi and vote on it.
That is if Pelosi even allows it to get on the house floor. If she obstructs it, she will look really bad, especially if moderate dims begin speaking out.
If Nancy is not careful, she could find herself getting voted out of the Speaker's chair.
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And Trump outs them as anti American scum yet again. Go Trump!
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Nancy will ultimately suffer defeat over this.
The dims are starting to question giving her the Speaker's gavel.
BTW, notice Chuck is being somewhat quiet today.
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I think this is just the first shot across the bow. He's now negotiating in public. Once the reject this he'll up the ante and keep upping the ante as long as they keep rejecting it and he can then tell America that they have never intended to fund a wall period and never wanted to negotiate in good faith.
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This is far from over.
https://www.speaker.gov/newsroom/11919/
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Pelosi's response was that we need better entry port security.
What good are secure doors if there are no walls to force people to use the doors?
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I think this is just the first shot across the bow. He's now negotiating in public. Once the reject this he'll up the ante and keep upping the ante as long as they keep rejecting it and he can then tell America that they have never intended to fund a wall period and never wanted to negotiate in good faith.
I think you're right. He could offer full instant amnesty to all illegals already here, voting rights and all, if they'll just give him $5.7 billion for a wall. The Democrats under any other president would have grabbed that and thought they'd won the lottery but these lunatics will reject it SOLELY because it's Trump and they're like a 2year old digging in heels saying "No!" just to hear themselves say no even if it's something they want. Exactly like my toddler grandson. "Do you want a cookie?" "NO!! ... um, er, uh..." look of consternation. Only unlike my grandson who is smart enough to quickly reconsider and change his answer, the Dems will spitefully stick with their "no" until Trump is gone.
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This President understands the constitutional roles of each branch of government. And unlike his predecessor, who would just use a pen and a phone, he's trying to get congress to fix their problem.
But they don't want a fix. They want political pawns. And the only thing the dims want from their pawns are their votes, even when the dims throw them under the bus.
The house dims are waking up to a bad reality: They let Pelosi and her alt left progress base bully them into giving her the speakership. She is getting them boxed into a corner and has demonstrated she's not the political powerhouse she led them to believe. She is nothing more than a vindictive power hungry sick old woman (sound familiar?).
McConnell knows he has the votes to get the President's proposed bill through the senate. Notice how Schumer is being quiet? Once this goes through the senate with bipartisan support, it goes to Nancy's desk. So does Nancy refuse to bring it to the floor, and show everyone her true colors? She knows if she puts it forward, enough dims will vote for it along with the Republicans to pass it, and princess Nancy suffers an embarrassing defeat at the hands of the President. If she refuses to put it on the floor, she knows the President and the Republicans will burn her in effigy.
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Pelosi's response was that we need better entry port security.
What good are secure doors if there are no walls to force people to use the doors?
An obvious truth to rational people. We’ll see how many rational Dems there are.
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Nancy will ultimately suffer defeat over this.
The dims are starting to question giving her the Speaker's gavel.
BTW, notice Chuck is being somewhat quiet today.
Nancy is so frightened of the new Socialist activist members of her party that she’s doing everything in her power to out-Wacko them, which ain’t easy with Ocasio Cortez.
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This President understands the constitutional roles of each branch of government. And unlike his predecessor, who would just use a pen and a phone, he's trying to get congress to fix their problem.
But they don't want a fix. They want political pawns. And the only thing the dims want from their pawns are their votes, even when the dims throw them under the bus.
The house dims are waking up to a bad reality: They let Pelosi and her alt left progress base bully them into giving her the speakership. She is getting them boxed into a corner and has demonstrated she's not the political powerhouse she led them to believe. She is nothing more than a vindictive power hungry sick old woman (sound familiar?).
McConnell knows he has the votes to get the President's proposed bill through the senate. Notice how Schumer is being quiet? Once this goes through the senate with bipartisan support, it goes to Nancy's desk. So does Nancy refuse to bring it to the floor, and show everyone her true colors? She knows if she puts it forward, enough dims will vote for it along with the Republicans to pass it, and princess Nancy suffers an embarrassing defeat at the hands of the President. If she refuses to put it on the floor, she knows the President and the Republicans will burn her in effigy.
I hope McConnell does bring this to a vote. Even if it doesn't get 60 votes, force the Democrats to vote down the legislation. It'll make it all the more clear that Democrats are only interested in stopping Trump.
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The National Review Editors have an article up regarding Trump's shutdown offer:
It was a reasonable proposal to exchange a temporary amnesty for beneficiaries of DACA (the so-called Dreamers) and TPS (illegal immigrants who supposedly couldn’t go home because of war or natural disasters) for $5.7 billion for border barriers, $800 million for humanitarian programs at the border, some changes in asylum rules, and more border agents and immigration judges.
Nancy Pelosi rejected it out of hand, even before hearing his formal televised offer. The progressive case against the deal is that it trades something temporary, the amnesty, which would theoretically last only three years, for something permanent: the fencing at the border. But this is an argument for making a counteroffer, not for refusing to negotiate.
https://www.nationalreview.com/2019/01/trump-offer-government-shutdown-border-wall-immigration/
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At this point, the Democrats own the shutdown yet the media continues to blame Trump.
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At this point, the Democrats own the shutdown yet the media continues to blame Trump.
And they try to claim that most conservatives blame Trump too. What a crock.
Of course, I do know some conservatives that will say things like that to keep their liberal acquaintances from spontaneously combusting.
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And they try to claim that most conservatives blame Trump too. What a crock.
Of course, I do know some conservatives that will say things like that to keep their liberal acquaintances from spontaneously combusting.
And Liberal acquaintances spontaneously combusting is a bad thing? :)
I have a three liberal combustion quota PER DAY!
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At this point, I would like to see Trump offer permanent status for DACA, and an extension of some time period for TPS. Then let Pelosi's base see how she really feels.
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At this point, I would like to see Trump offer permanent status for DACA, and an extension of some time period for TPS. Then let Pelosi's base see how she really feels.
If the Dems really wanted to compromise, they would be the ones bringing this up. At this Point it might even pass.
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If the Dems really wanted to compromise, they would be the ones bringing this up. At this Point it might even pass.
As long as the Dems keep their mouths shut, they can get the media to blame the shutdown on Trump. If Trump makes a serious offer and they refuse, then it is harder to blame Trump. The MSM will still try to blame Trump, but I don't think it would go over as well.
I think Trump should make one more offer (like I suggested), OR pull the current offer off the table and loudly and publicly announce that he is expecting an offer from the Dems. If they make an offer he doesn't like, then he can make a counter offer.
How come I no longer hear the phrase "The Party of NO"?
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As long as the Dems keep their mouths shut, they can get the media to blame the shutdown on Trump. If Trump makes a serious offer and they refuse, then it is harder to blame Trump. The MSM will still try to blame Trump, but I don't think it would go over as well.
I think Trump should make one more offer (like I suggested), OR pull the current offer off the table and loudly and publicly announce that he is expecting an offer from the Dems. If they make an offer he doesn't like, then he can make a counter offer.
How come I no longer hear the phrase "The Party of NO"?
I don’t think so. He’s being advised to negotiate with himself, which he did on Saturday. That never ends well.
He should say that’s his best and final offer, and let Pelosi stew on that.
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I don’t think so. He’s being advised to negotiate with himself, which he did on Saturday. That never ends well.
He should say that’s his best and final offer, and let Pelosi stew on that.
You are probably right. But I knew without a doubt, when I first heard he was proposing temporary extensions of DACA and TPS that it would never fly. To be honest, if I was on the other side, I wouldn't accept temporary extensions for a permanent wall either. A permanent solution to DACA, and a temporary extension to TPS would be a win-win in return for the wall, (and maybe even an end to chain migration and birthright citizenship).
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You are probably right. But I knew without a doubt, when I first heard he was proposing temporary extensions of DACA and TPS that it would never fly. To be honest, if I was on the other side, I wouldn't accept temporary extensions for a permanent wall either. A permanent solution to DACA, and a temporary extension to TPS would be a win-win in return for the wall, (and maybe even an end to chain migration and birthright citizenship).
I never thought I’d see the day when American citizens viewed a permanent wall, protecting their own country, as a problem. Or that the fact that millions of people having BROKEN THE LAW to dwell here is “not a problem.”
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You are probably right. But I knew without a doubt, when I first heard he was proposing temporary extensions of DACA and TPS that it would never fly. To be honest, if I was on the other side, I wouldn't accept temporary extensions for a permanent wall either. A permanent solution to DACA, and a temporary extension to TPS would be a win-win in return for the wall, (and maybe even an end to chain migration and birthright citizenship).
What Trump is asking for is not even the entire wall, it's only $5.7 billion worth of funding for the wall. But he made an offer and the Democrats wouldn't even make a counter-offer, just a straight rejection.
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What Trump is asking for is not even the entire wall, it's only $5.7 billion worth of funding for the wall. But he made an offer and the Democrats wouldn't even make a counter-offer, just a straight rejection.
Because the Democrats want unlimited Amnesty, which is Open Borders. They will not agree to anything that has to do with enhanced border security. Then they lie to your face, and say they are not for Open Borders.
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Because the Democrats want unlimited Amnesty, which is Open Borders. They will not agree to anything that has to do with enhanced border security. Then they lie to your face, and say they are not for Open Borders.
Several Democrats have come out and said that they would give trump the $5.7 billion for border security as long as it was not for the wall. Steny Hoyer was one of them. At some point, we'll have an opportunity to see if he follows through with that. For now, however, Trump wants the wall so we'll see what a final bill looks like. I haven't gone through his voting record to see where he's voted on previous border security, but I'm sure it's there.
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Several Democrats have come out and said that they would give trump the $5.7 billion for border security as long as it was not for the wall. Steny Hoyer was one of them. At some point, we'll have an opportunity to see if he follows through with that. For now, however, Trump wants the wall so we'll see what a final bill looks like. I haven't gone through his voting record to see where he's voted on previous border security, but I'm sure it's there.
Equivalent to a contractor selling you on enhanced door and window locks but leaving sheetrock and siding off oh, say two exterior walls.
Dems who say yes to security but no to a wall are telegraphing their loyalty to anti-Americanism.
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Several Democrats have come out and said that they would give trump the $5.7 billion for border security as long as it was not for the wall. Steny Hoyer was one of them. At some point, we'll have an opportunity to see if he follows through with that. For now, however, Trump wants the wall so we'll see what a final bill looks like. I haven't gone through his voting record to see where he's voted on previous border security, but I'm sure it's there.
I am not a Border Security expert, so I don't know if there are more effective tools than a wall to keep illegals out. What is so bad to the Democrats about a Wall? It certainly can't hurt border security. So my point remains. Why are the Democrats against border security in general?
To me giving money for other methods to secure the border just means more bureaucracy, more corruption, more government do nothing jobs, and maybe more questionable technology.
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I am not a Border Security expert, so I don't know if there are more effective tools than a wall to keep illegals out. What is so bad to the Democrats about a Wall? It certainly can't hurt border security. So my point remains. Why are the Democrats against border security in general?
I don't think this has ANYTHING to do with border security, in their eyes. It's all about not caving in to Trump, because, one, they don't want to set a precedent that will make it easier for a president to play the same gambit in the future to advance an agenda; and two, he's "proudly owned" the shutdown, and they hope to lower his approval rating to an unrecoverable level. Mostly I think it's really about 2020.
Hopefully the public will turn on them when it becomes clear they aren't going to give an inch, despite the hundreds of thousands of government workers they're using as pawns in this game.
And when I say "they', I really do mean both sides, as Trump shares considerable blame in my eyes. A pox on both houses.
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I will not blame President Trump at all, and feel anyone choosing to try and make it so is playing games.
The last five presidents all campaigned on the promise of border security.
Each of them proclaimed that illegal aliens were a terrible burden and security risk.
They all had money in the budget appropriated to build a wall.
When the current president actually acted on those same promises the fucking communists (they call themselves democrats) showed their real intentions.
NONE of that can be blamed on President Trump and a pox on anyone pretending that it can be.
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I think Trump's demeanor, along with the Republican Establishment are part of the problem sometimes, so the Republicans do have a small share in the blame. Now it also may be true that if Trump played nice they'd walk all over him, and then still would NOT cooperate, or compromise. I think Azure is right about the Dems just not wanting to give into Trump, and let him get ANYTHING he wants.
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I agree with David Brooks on this (and on quite a few things). Getting money for border security is a worthy cause, but shutting down the government is not the way to accomplish that goal. The worst part is that national defense is affected to some extent (e.g. DHS including the USCG), despite the boots on the ground who are still working without pay. I can't believe the quality of their work isn't being affected.
And I think that Trump walked into a trap by declaring that he'd be proud to shut down the government over this. Now he can't blink, and the Dems won't since they smell blood. The whole thing is just fucked up and there seems to be no way for either side to save face.
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I am not a Border Security expert, so I don't know if there are more effective tools than a wall to keep illegals out. What is so bad to the Democrats about a Wall? It certainly can't hurt border security. So my point remains. Why are the Democrats against border security in general?
To me giving money for other methods to secure the border just means more bureaucracy, more corruption, more government do nothing jobs, and maybe more questionable technology.
Until we stop this catch and release BS sensors and drones let us know where to send the welcome wagon for the new residents/voters. That's what border security means to them, not allowing new residents/voters to become injured on the dangerous journey.
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Here's some perspective:
https://dailycaller.com/2019/01/24/democrats-reject-shutdown-deals-trump/
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This is true.
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This is true.
JB, can you give us a sense of what the folks in your line of work think about blame for this shutdown? Is it universally seen as Trump’s fault as we see daily on TV, or is it shared blame? Just curious what you see from the trenches.
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Here's some perspective:
https://dailycaller.com/2019/01/24/democrats-reject-shutdown-deals-trump/
Walls are not who they are. Drugs, gangs, dead citizens, and hundreds of millions of dollars spent on illegals is who they are. And by God that’s not gonna change.
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(http://www.pilotspin.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=3285.0;attach=942)
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Haven't logged in here in a while. Nice to read some common sense viewpoints. While I think there is plenty of blame to go around I tend to lean to the right and as such I'm biased to support facts that support my agenda.
That said... everything I've heard from the Border Patrol has said that they need more walls as well as other things. This includes personal testimony from my Helicopter flying buddies that work at the BP.
Here is one such narrative stolen from a friend's Facebook post - he wished to stay anonymous...
Lots of opinions will be gathered from either side of the political party. As someone with now 5 years experience on the border, I am here to tell you walls/barriers work, and more importantly keep family units from the harsh environments they can encounter once they are in the United States. These barriers and walls are actually all over already and they work. So what if the wall or barriers don’t stop them, keeping in mind they are being smuggled by cartel orizations, who will leave them as soon as they are too weak to continue!
Let me give you one of my experiences.
Three years ago I responded to a 911 call of an alien in distress. The 19 year old son and father were abandoned in the Texas heat during the summer. Since the son did not know where he was in the vast Texas landscape, all I had to go off was cell phone towers, 3 in fact, in about a 40 mile radius. After 7 hours of flight time, we finally found the son, who for the 3rd time, ran 1.5 miles to huge power line poles, from where his father was located. I landed in a tight landing zone, dropped off 2 BORSTAR agents (google them) who put two bags of fluid into the father, who was having extreme heat stroke, along with assessing the son. I made the call to fly him to an airport near by because I knew local ems helicopters, by policy, wouldn’t be able to land. As we loaded the father into my helicopter his bowels released and went all over us and the aircraft. I made the decision to continue to fly him to the awaiting EMS. Below is the photo after I landed. The father ended up passing away. A barrier can funnel these unknowing illegal migrants into the safety of the border patrol. Most asylum cases allow them to stay. Politics aside illegal immigration is extremely dangerous. This is just 1 story of thousands each year, over 4300 Rescues in 2018 by CBP.
Since I've started flying at the Airlines I've been spending more time online at https://forums.jetcareers.com/ than I have at POA. Jeebus Christmas though I couldn't even think about posting what I just posted here over there. If'n ya'll want to waste a bunch of time arguing with the left leaners there is more than I can deal with LOL.
Anyhow, as stated here - the fact the Dims won't fund a wall tells me they are not serious about people's safety at all - as well as all the other salient points made here.
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or maybe the drug cartels are making huge donations to keep a wall from being built. ;)
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https://www.cnsnews.com/commentary/david-limbaugh/david-limbaugh-trump-and-his-supporters-are-fight-long-haul