PILOT SPIN
Spin Zone => Spin Zone => Topic started by: Lucifer on March 24, 2016, 12:16:03 PM
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http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2016/mar/24/obama-takes-two-air-force-one-planes-argentina/
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I think having a backup VC25 is standard operating procedure.
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Yeah, I don't have a problem with this.
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Yeah, I don't have a problem with this.
Yea, flying a B757 round trip from DC to Argentina just to be used so the President and family can "sightsee" is just peanuts.......
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Yea, flying a B757 round trip from DC to Argentina just to be used so the President and family can "sightsee" is just peanuts.......
No, it's freaking expensive, but it's part of the office and more importantly the president's safety, at some point you have to accept the need for this regardless of who is in the office. Isn't it a 747?
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No, it's freaking expensive, but it's part of the office and more importantly the president's safety, at some point you have to accept the need for this regardless of who is in the office. Isn't it a 747?
No, they flew down in a B747-200. The B757 was flown down for just the sight seeing trip for the Royal, uh, I mean the First Family.
It's one thing to use the 747 for state business, but flying an empty B757 (20+ hour round trip) just for "sight seeing" is over the top.
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No, it's freaking expensive, but it's part of the office and more importantly the president's safety, at some point you have to accept the need for this regardless of who is in the office. Isn't it a 747?
The have both the 747 and the 757.
And to think Air Force One used to be a Constellation.
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See how quickly people say, "its no problem, just the cost of taking care of the President" Are you fucking kidding me? We now treat the President like a fucking King. Where did that come from?
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I find it ironic that a President who claims that we need to make a serious effort to combat climate change and move away from our dependence on fossil fuels brought two large jet aircraft.
Andrew Wilkow has a saying for this: "Socialism is for the people, not the socialists".
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I find it ironic that a President who claims that we need to make a serious effort to combat climate change and move away from our dependence on fossil fuels brought two large jet aircraft.
Andrew Wilkow has a saying for this: "Socialism is for the people, not the socialists".
Don't forget the advance team and the support aircraft
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See how quickly people say, "its no problem, just the cost of taking care of the President" Are you fucking kidding me? We now treat the President like a fucking King. Where did that come from?
I said it, and what the fuck will it cost both economically and socially if a president is assassinated? As far as I know this has been standard MO for a long time, give the people in charge of protecting the president what they need to protect him and don't politicize it.
If you don't like the guy fine, but there is more than enough to criticize about him than his security detail, which he probably has little say in.
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I said it, and what the fuck will it cost both economically and socially if a president is assassinated? As far as I know this has been standard MO for a long time, give the people in charge of protecting the president what they need to protect him and don't politicize it.
If you don't like the guy fine, but there is more than enough to criticize about him than his security detail, which he probably has little say in.
Previous Presidents didn't expect (and demand) to be treated as royalty. President Bush refrained from playing golf because he felt it would look bad to the American people if he was living it up on the golf course while the country was at war. He also "vacationed" at his Crawford ranch which already had everything set up security wise and didn't appear lavish to the people.
Obama takes vacations everywhere, sometimes his wife decides she doesn't want to travel with him and takes a separate jet. The First Lady also has the largest staff ever of assistants. The Bush daughters didn't get lavish vacations at the tax payers expense unlike the Obama's.
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I said it, and what the fuck will it cost both economically and socially if a president is assassinated? As far as I know this has been standard MO for a long time, give the people in charge of protecting the president what they need to protect him and don't politicize it.
If you don't like the guy fine, but there is more than enough to criticize about him than his security detail, which he probably has little say in.
Paul, it is one thing to take AF1 to a country for state purposes, or even throw in a little vacation. It's quite another to take a second AF1 to do some "family sightseeing" to areas with smaller airports. That's not my wording, that's from the article.
The decision to do this "family sightseeing" is his, not his security detail. The cost is irrelevant to him, and he knows it. This is not a trip to Crawford, Texas. This is symptomatic of Obama's massive abuse of the People's trust, such as having Michelle Obama take a separate plane to Hawaii.
The guy enjoys the trappings of the office more than actually holding the office.
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Paul, it is one thing to take AF1 to a country for state purposes, or even throw in a little vacation. It's quite another to take a second AF1 to do some "family sightseeing" to areas with smaller airports. That's not my wording, that's from the article.
Well, to be technical, there's no such thing as a "second AF1". There is only ever a maximum of one AF1. It doesn't matter if POTUS is flying on an Air Force Cessna 206, that plane is AF1.
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Well, to be technical, there's no such thing as a "second AF1". There is only ever a maximum of one AF1. It doesn't matter if POTUS is flying on an Air Force Cessna 206, that plane is AF1.
I know. I get that. It was just longer to say "a second United States Air Force aircraft, a Boeing C-32, the military transport version of a Boring 757, which would be designated Air Force One once the President of the United States is on board" than saying a "second AF1."
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I know. I get that. It was just longer to say "a second United States Air Force aircraft, a Boeing C-32, the military transport version of a Boring 757, which would be designated Air Force One once the President of the United States is on board" than saying a "second AF1."
I've never seen a 757 being used as AF1. I've seen it as AF2 (saw it at my local airport when Obama and Biden came to town for some announcement or other), but POTUS typically travels on the VC-25, not VC-32.
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Michelle's mother is along on this trip, I wonder who is paying for that? I believe that whenever a trip likes this happens, Democrat or Republican, a public accounting of the dollars spent should be posted showing what it cost and what was paid by the President for personal stuff.
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My understanding is there are always 2 747's that travel with with the President and ne is just a backup.
Cannot currently find info to back that up
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I've never seen a 757 being used as AF1. I've seen it as AF2 (saw it at my local airport when Obama and Biden came to town for some announcement or other), but POTUS typically travels on the VC-25, not VC-32.
I just checked Wiki for "Boeing C-32" and it says "Presidents Barack Obama, George W. Bush, and Bill Clinton have at times flown on a C-32 as Air Force One in place of the larger VC-25A."
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Michelle's mother is along on this trip, I wonder who is paying for that? I believe that whenever a trip likes this happens, Democrat or Republican, a public accounting of the dollars spent should be posted showing what it cost and what was paid by the President for personal stuff.
Agreed. Add fundraisers to the mix as well.
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I said it, and what the fuck will it cost both economically and socially if a president is assassinated? As far as I know this has been standard MO for a long time, give the people in charge of protecting the president what they need to protect him and don't politicize it.
If you don't like the guy fine, but there is more than enough to criticize about him than his security detail, which he probably has little say in.
We have a plan for succession in the event the President dies or is assassinated. The market was just decimated when Kennedy was assassinated.
https://www.quora.com/What-were-the-consequences-on-the-stock-market-after-the-assassination-of-John-F-Kennedy
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I just checked Wiki for "Boeing C-32" and it says "Presidents Barack Obama, George W. Bush, and Bill Clinton have at times flown on a C-32 as Air Force One in place of the larger VC-25A."
+1
Some airport destinations can't handle the 747 but can support smaller VIP aircraft like the VC-32.
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My understanding is there are always 2 747's that travel with with the President and ne is just a backup.
Cannot currently find info to back that up
This is my understanding also for when the president travels abroad. I intensely dislike Obama, but I won't rag on him for these security details.
Ragging on him for some of his trip choices is another story, but I think we'd be able to find examples like this for most modern presidents.
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This is my understanding also for when the president travels abroad. I intensely dislike Obama, but I won't rag on him for these security details.
Ragging on him for some of his trip choices is another story, but I think we'd be able to find examples like this for most modern presidents.
Yeah.
And if I'm ever elected President, I will appreciate the fact that he has set a precedent that I can take my extended family on any number of uber-expensive exotic vacations and say "Well, Obama did it too"!
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I really hate that you guys are making me defend Obama, but he flies in an aircraft that can carry 76 passengers on top of crew and that regularly carries hundreds more than that in its commercial model. Bringing family along really doesn't amount to anything in the scheme of things.
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I really hate that you guys are making me defend Obama, but he flies in an aircraft that can carry 76 passengers on top of crew and that regularly carries hundreds more than that in its commercial model. Bringing family along really doesn't amount to anything in the scheme of things.
If he brought his family along in that 76 passenger airplane, that would be a different story.
It is when they come along in different jumbo-jet, and/or use a different jumbo-jet to go site seeing.
As Obama would say "it is bad optics"! In other words, it looks like shit. But he doesn't care.
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I really hate that you guys are making me defend Obama, but he flies in an aircraft that can carry 76 passengers on top of crew and that regularly carries hundreds more than that in its commercial model. Bringing family along really doesn't amount to anything in the scheme of things.
So your company would allow you to take your MIL along on a business trip and allow their customers to pay for it?
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I think the use of presidential aircraft should be limited to presidential business with a limited exception for "optional" mileage each year. Optional mileage could be used for either vacation, or political fund raising. It would be a finite amount of miles, so you could take either several short flights in the US, or one long one to Brazil or something, but once it's spent, you have to wait until the next year, or pay for the flight yourself.
Just my fantasy. Of course the king/queen can do as he or she likes in reality.
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I think the use of presidential aircraft should be limited to presidential business with a limited exception for "optional" mileage each year. Optional mileage could be used for either vacation, or political fund raising. It would be a finite amount of miles, so you could take either several short flights in the US, or one long one to Brazil or something, but once it's spent, you have to wait until the next year, or pay for the flight yourself.
Just my fantasy. Of course the king/queen can do as he or she likes in reality.
The counter argument is that the President never takes a true vacation since he still receives his daily intelligence briefings, still meets with advisors, etc.
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I think the use of presidential aircraft should be limited to presidential business with a limited exception for "optional" mileage each year. Optional mileage could be used for either vacation, or political fund raising. It would be a finite amount of miles, so you could take either several short flights in the US, or one long one to Brazil or something, but once it's spent, you have to wait until the next year, or pay for the flight yourself.
Just my fantasy. Of course the king/queen can do as he or she likes in reality.
Why fund raising? Would you give all the other candidates free transportation for their fund raising?
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I thought for fund-raising trips, the campaign has to reimburse the Fedgov some of the travel costs? And I also thought the press on the Air Force aircraft have to pay the equivalent of the first class fare?? Am I misinformed?
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Why fund raising? Would you give all the other candidates free transportation for their fund raising?
Optional travel is optional travel. They can either spend it relaxing with family, or raising money for their party.
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I thought for fund-raising trips, the campaign has to reimburse the Fedgov some of the travel costs? And I also thought the press on the Air Force aircraft have to pay the equivalent of the first class fare?? Am I misinformed?
You might notice that they always combine a business trip with fund raising.