Post by: President-Elect Bob Noel on June 10, 2016, 08:03:48 AM
(no url, I read it in a real newpaper...)
Post by: LevelWing on June 10, 2016, 09:03:40 AM
Post by: Dav8or on June 10, 2016, 09:08:41 AM
Post by: President-Elect Bob Noel on June 10, 2016, 09:14:34 AM
If people are interested in doing something about gun violence, then they should be advocating enforcing existing gun laws.
And while people wring their hands about gun violence, they don't seem to notice when guns are in fact taken off the street (again, enforcing existing laws). And they are strangly silent when more students are stabbed in school than are shot (iow-there is a fixation on gun violence rather than all violence)
No need to take guns from the millions of people that use them legally and safely.
Post by: LevelWing on June 10, 2016, 09:18:20 AM
I guess I was waaaaaaaaay too subtle.Why enforce existing gun laws? Unless you pass a new, more restrictive law, you aren't actually doing anything about gun violence. ;)
If people are interested in doing something about gun violence, then they should be advocating enforcing existing gun laws.
And while people wring their hands about gun violence, they don't seem to notice when guns are in fact taken off the street (again, enforcing existing laws). And they are strangly silent when more students are stabbed in school than are shot (iow-there is a fixation on gun violence rather than all violence)
No need to take guns from the millions of people that use them legally and safely.
Post by: nddons on June 10, 2016, 12:02:47 PM
Why enforce existing gun laws? Unless you pass a new, more restrictive law, you aren't actually doing anything about gun violence. ;)Exactly. Plus you get to feeeeeel soooo good by actual "Doing something."
Post by: bflynn on June 10, 2016, 05:07:54 PM
Post by: LevelWing on June 10, 2016, 05:15:22 PM
What is the diference between an alleged gang member having a gun and me having a gun? Assuming we are otherwise equal, not felons, etc. or for that matter, an actual gang member.Legally, nothing. But the gang member is far more likely to be looked at harder (profiled, if you will) than you are.
Post by: bflynn on June 10, 2016, 07:07:25 PM
Legally, nothing. But the gang member is far more likely to be looked at harder (profiled, if you will) than you are.
So? Are they also far more likely to have their civil rights violated / have a gun illegally taken from them? In other words, will the police protect them less than they protect me?
Post by: President-Elect Bob Noel on June 10, 2016, 07:13:59 PM
What is the diference between an alleged gang member having a gun and me having a gun? Assuming we are otherwise equal, not felons, etc. or for that matter, an actual gang member.
Nothing.
We don't have all the specifics wrt the sweep that resulted in the arrest of a whole bunch of guys and siezure of the guns. For all we know, the guns were taken when the various people were arrested when the people didn't have a valid LTC to possess the firearm.
I would hope you don't have a problem with the police confiscating a firearm from someone that doesn't a valid LTC.
Post by: President in Exile YOLT on June 10, 2016, 07:18:53 PM
Exactly. Plus you get to feeeeeel soooo good by actual "Doing something."
Post by: LevelWing on June 10, 2016, 09:08:47 PM
So? Are they also far more likely to have their civil rights violated / have a gun illegally taken from them? In other words, will the police protect them less than they protect me?They shouldn't. Though I would argue the gang will probably protect them as well, just in different ways.
Post by: LevelWing on June 10, 2016, 09:10:31 PM
Nothing.It's sad that you even have to add the bit about "license to carry" in there. You shouldn't need a license for something already protected by the Constitution, but that's another issue.
We don't have all the specifics wrt the sweep that resulted in the arrest of a whole bunch of guys and siezure of the guns. For all we know, the guns were taken when the various people were arrested when the people didn't have a valid LTC to possess the firearm.
I would hope you don't have a problem with the police confiscating a firearm from someone that doesn't a valid LTC.
Post by: President-Elect Bob Noel on June 11, 2016, 03:50:51 AM
It's sad that you even have to add the bit about "license to carry" in there. You shouldn't need a license for something already protected by the Constitution, but that's another issue.
I was thinking about that when I was typing the post...
Post by: Anthony on June 11, 2016, 04:28:14 AM
What is the diference between an alleged gang member having a gun and me having a gun? Assuming we are otherwise equal, not felons, etc. or for that matter, an actual gang member.
By definition "gang members" are TYPICALLY criminals, and prohibited from LEGALLY owning firearms. Are you joking, or is this a serious question?
Post by: bflynn on June 11, 2016, 05:18:41 AM
Now, if you can prove they committed a crime then an individual is a criminal, but that is different. Plus this was Boston, a bastion of liberal mis-thought.
Post by: Anthony on June 11, 2016, 06:06:39 AM
It is serious. If someone is alleged to be in a gang, why should that change their Constitutional rights? Someone alleged to be in a gang has the same right to own a gun as you and I do. The fact of accusation should change nothing.
Now, if you can prove they committed a crime then an individual is a criminal, but that is different. Plus this was Boston, a bastion of liberal mis-thought.
I am talking reality, not theory. The vast majority of gang members have extensive criminal records. Of course I believe in guilty until proven innocent.
Post by: JeffDG on June 11, 2016, 06:13:04 AM
I am talking reality, not theory. The vast majority of gang members have extensive criminal records. Of course I believe in guilty until proven innocent.OK, I say you killed a 14 year old hooker last year. Now, prove your innocence! Go!
Post by: Anthony on June 11, 2016, 06:22:13 AM
OK, I say you killed a 14 year old hooker last year. Now, prove your innocence! Go!
I was being facetious. You are really perceptive!
Post by: LevelWing on June 11, 2016, 06:41:07 AM
It is serious. If someone is alleged to be in a gang, why should that change their Constitutional rights? Someone alleged to be in a gang has the same right to own a gun as you and I do. The fact of accusation should change nothing.It doesn't. There's just an assumption that if you're in a gang that you're already a criminal and not allowed to legally have guns. I'm sure the police ran each name to verify.
Now, if you can prove they committed a crime then an individual is a criminal, but that is different. Plus this was Boston, a bastion of liberal mis-thought.